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Kodaemon
12th Jun 2010, 09:12
So, I'm surprised no one's commented on the NEO+ revelation that people in Shanghai apparently actually speak chinese. This is GREAT news. Always adds to immersion in a big way.

Now on to wishful thinking and speculation. There's an intriguing possibility this creates for a game like DX3: the translator aug. Imagine, you stroll around Shanghai oblivious to what most people are saying to each other, then you get the aug and translated subtitles start showing on your HUD. Suddenly, you get a lot more information: a lage portion of it is junk of course, but some might actually be useful. Imagine a situation where two characters want to give you a quest. They speak to you in english, but in chinese to each other. Now, if Adam has the aug (or you know chinese, heheh), you notice the npcs actually want to lure you into a trap. Sounds interesting?

SageSavage
12th Jun 2010, 09:36
Yep! Another recent game that uses two different languages without translation is Red Dead Redemption. Most people on the Mexican side of the border only speak Spanish. Story relevant Mexicans either use another person as translator or speak with a believable Spanish accent.

JackShandy
12th Jun 2010, 10:18
Stalker did it to great effect, too. Good news!

ZakKa89
12th Jun 2010, 10:49
Really good news. Unless like other people, i don't mind reading subtitles. I'm also a "sub before dub" guy.

SageSavage
12th Jun 2010, 10:51
Yeah, but in this case we're more talking about using foreign languages without subs (unless you have a translator).

FreedomForever
12th Jun 2010, 11:12
That is badass!!!!!!!!!

Is little things like these that make games better....I havn't kept up with all deus ex news but I hope theres multiple languages that we wont understand.

Augs that let your read subtitles or even then translate what there saying so you can hear it and translate what you're saying will be amazing.

Irate_Iguana
12th Jun 2010, 11:19
Hitman also has this. Most characters speak in their native tongue. When they talk to Mr. 47 they always have a heavy accent and some use broken English. Gives a nice atmosphere.

ChrisVCB
12th Jun 2010, 11:22
Aww, I was hoping for "Awh.....Mistah Adam Jensen....in da fwesh!"

TezJaggs
12th Jun 2010, 12:45
Aww, I was hoping for "Awh.....Mistah Adam Jensen....in da fwesh!"

WOW
talk about racist.

K.Karisma
12th Jun 2010, 12:47
WOW
talk about racist.

Did you never play Deus Ex's Hong Kong stage? lol

ChrisVCB
12th Jun 2010, 12:50
Shhh, quite obviously I cannot possibly be referring to the voice acting of the first game, and must be a raging racist.

@TezJaggs; get a clue.

TezJaggs
12th Jun 2010, 13:02
havent played it for about 8 years no so dont remember that.
my bad.

jtr7
12th Jun 2010, 13:29
You haven't played it in 8 years and are giving fans of DX crap, in your few first posts, for their fondness for it and concerns that the new one will be too different in spirit? You need to rethink your attitude for posting here, as it's been unpleasant so far. I don't know what you think people are supposed to talk about for years in anticipation, but you have some gall ripping into people for their attitude. What are people supposed to talk about if not their likes and dislikes, hopes and fears, and why do you think this forum for discussion and debate and opinion was created, and why it's read and studied by EM?





Anyway, getting authentic with the dialects, and hopefully other significant cultural qualities, is a great move, and of course, with Square-Enix and French-speaking Canadians, I would fully expect the languages to be treated with more pride and care, especially with this kind of financial backing.

Corpus
12th Jun 2010, 13:38
I wonder if there will be a translator Aug. Certainly seems a likely social Aug, help you listen in on conversations etc.

pringlepower
12th Jun 2010, 19:39
so there's gonna at least be Chinese and Quebecois French?
sweet

ZakKa89
12th Jun 2010, 21:37
Wasn't cairo a location in the game? If that means we'll also hear some arabic, sweeeet

hem dazon 90
12th Jun 2010, 21:51
thank god we don't have to listen to those godawful chinese accents again.

Would the people in montreal speak french?

Ashpolt
12th Jun 2010, 21:57
So, I'm surprised no one's commented on the NEO+ revelation that people in Shanghai apparently actually speak chinese. This is GREAT news. Always adds to immersion in a big way.

Now on to wishful thinking and speculation. There's an intriguing possibility this creates for a game like DX3: the translator aug. Imagine, you stroll around Shanghai oblivious to what most people are saying to each other, then you get the aug and translated subtitles start showing on your HUD. Suddenly, you get a lot more information: a lage portion of it is junk of course, but some might actually be useful. Imagine a situation where two characters want to give you a quest. They speak to you in english, but in chinese to each other. Now, if Adam has the aug (or you know chinese, heheh), you notice the npcs actually want to lure you into a trap. Sounds interesting?

Great idea! It'd work really well if the subtitles were displayed in an augmented-reality style, like the mission objectives in Splinter Cell: Conviction (only not so massive, obviously.) It could even unlock further response options for Adam in conversation, allowing him to gain the respect of some xenophobic types.

pringlepower
12th Jun 2010, 22:30
thank god we don't have to listen to those godawful chinese accents again.

Would the people in montreal speak french?

even if they didn't you wouldn't have to worry about godawful accents. hell the developers could all have cameos

FatDragon
13th Jun 2010, 03:34
I hope they speak Chinese in Shanghai - won't need a translator there!

Pinky_Powers
13th Jun 2010, 03:53
I hope they speak Chinese in Shanghai - won't need a translator there!

Do you speak both Chinese tongues?

TheYouthCounselor
13th Jun 2010, 03:56
I agree that a translator aug sounds like a brilliant idea. I was going to suggest that too, but you ninja'd me to it.

Two characters speaking, could provide all sorts of important clues. A man speaking another language might have important quest information.

JackShandy
13th Jun 2010, 04:00
What a cool idea! Shame it probably won't happen...

pringlepower
13th Jun 2010, 04:11
What a cool idea! Shame it probably won't happen...

your lack of faith... disturbs me

FatDragon
13th Jun 2010, 04:22
I speak decent Mandarin, though everyday conversation in a game like DE3 would probably tax my skills since I'd be likely to get tripped up on a lot of nouns - being by far the widest category of vocabulary in most languages; all the better for practice. The odds are pretty low that they would speak Cantonese (rare in Shanghai) or Shanghainese, which would limit voice-actor selection and is a little too specific for most game developers to think of, not to mention everyone in Shanghai can speak Putonghua - standard Mandarin - anyway.

Of course, in a year or so, when the game is released, my Mandarin should be notably better, so I might have little or no problem with the conversations in Shanghai when I finally get a chance to play through the game.

On a related note - the idea of a translator aug is pretty sweet, though there could be a couple caveats... A) Just because I understand Chinese doesn't mean that the protagonist will, so it might be required for information acquisition (such as codes and passwords) regardless of my personal understanding, especially if they mimic IW's rubbish password memory system, where your character either knows it or he doesn't, and there's nothing for you to remember. Then again, mimicking DX's system might not work either - codes and passwords that don't change from game to game can make future playthroughs too easy... B) The decision to install a translator aug might conflict with a much more useful one, limiting the ability of the more prudent player to understand the whole story. Then again, that could encourage further playthroughs...

Jets
13th Jun 2010, 05:48
Do you speak both Chinese tongues?

Do you mean Mandarin and Cantonese (two tongues most commonly spoken in Chinatowns around the world) or Mandarin and Shanghainese (two tongues most commonly spoken in Shanghai)?

This is actually a really interesting question (yours, not mine) in light of the fact that Deus Ex III will be set 17 years in our future. At present, Shanghainese people of all ages speak Shanghainese within their own family/friends groups of other Shanghainese people, but in public settings will often speak Mandarin.

Younger people, from what I've seen, will often prefer Mandarin because, even if they speak their local dialect within their family from birth, they use Mandarin at school every day once they get to that age and use it to speak to friends (I really don't know how many families in Shanghai teach their children Mandarin before school age). Younger people in their teens and 20s also speak hugely-varying degrees of English.

Older people I've met here can generally speak very heavily accented and relatively difficult-to-understand Mandarin. By the time 17 years from now has passed, there will still be many, many people who speak Shanghainese but very few who cannot speak decent (albeit somewhat accented) Mandarin.

I think.

FatDragon
13th Jun 2010, 08:11
Considering that I've heard Mandarin passed off as Cantonese, Vietnamese, Thai, and other Asian languages in different forms of American media, and that Mandarin is the official standard language throughout the majority of China, I would be very surprised if they decided to go with Shanghainese or Cantonese in DX:HR.

Now the other question is: will a native Mandarin speaker be writing the Chinese dialogue, or will it be translated by a native speaker from dialogue written in English, or will it be some halfway-proficient moron like myself who writes the dialogue? That could make a big difference in quality. Also, if it's translated in some way, I think it would be terrific to make it a bit Chinglishy, for more authenticity. After all, it takes a significant amount of adjustment to turn natural-sounding Chinese into natural-sounding English, leaving in some of the quirks (from an English speaker's perspective) adds to the effect and reveals some things about the language and the culture that grew up with it.

Jets
13th Jun 2010, 08:59
You've seen Mandarin passed off as Cantonese, Thai and Vietnamese in the media??? That is disturbing.

In regards to your other point regarding Chinglish, I probably agree. I'm a native English speaker, but after speaking Mandarin for 8 hours solid, I too have been known to produce some astonishing Chinglish. This does depend a great deal on the character's educational background, though.

FatDragon
13th Jun 2010, 12:00
Not in the news, or anything, but anyone with what is typically called 'yellow' skin is liable to speak Mandarin in many movies, for example, regardless of where they're supposed to come from.

To be fair, I can't give any definite examples. I know the Chinese girls in Broken Trail who spoke Mandarin were said to have been brought to the States from southern China, but there might have been something said about them being poor Northern girls who had been lured into bondage by promises of wealth and comfortable lives, I can't be sure. I just know that, since I started learning Mandarin, I've seen this happen in a number of films.

Oh, The Dark Knight - they're in Hong Kong, but the cops are speaking Mandarin. Sure, many Hong Kong residents can speak Mandarin, but would they be likely to in that situation? I've seen worse, if I could only remember where...

Daedalus Ciarán
13th Jun 2010, 12:28
I remember reading the first preview, in I think PCZone, about DX:HR and when they mentioned the game takes place in Shanghai I thought that'd be a great oppurtunity to have characters of different ethnicities. Thus as, say, a Chinese person, you'd be able to get further in the Shanghai level than in say, Detroit or Montréal. But if you decided to be an American it'd be the opposite. Then you could invest into the skill of learning a language. That could be balanced by a translation augmentation and the difference between learning the language and having an augmentation could mean greater respect from certain NPCs.

Translator aug though is okay. If a little boring, I enjoy multiple languages in films and games. Leaves something undiscovered unless you're a speaker of the language. Also adds to the realism and immersion of it. I can't watch WWII films where all the Germans and French speak English. With an English accent probably.

Yzerman
13th Jun 2010, 19:12
I hope that Deus Ex: HR has both French and Chinese speaking NPC's, as I'm learning those both languages.

pringlepower
13th Jun 2010, 19:57
I remember reading the first preview, in I think PCZone, about DX:HR and when they mentioned the game takes place in Shanghai I thought that'd be a great oppurtunity to have characters of different ethnicities. Thus as, say, a Chinese person, you'd be able to get further in the Shanghai level than in say, Detroit or Montréal. But if you decided to be an American it'd be the opposite. Then you could invest into the skill of learning a language. That could be balanced by a translation augmentation and the difference between learning the language and having an augmentation could mean greater respect from certain NPCs.

Translator aug though is okay. If a little boring, I enjoy multiple languages in films and games. Leaves something undiscovered unless you're a speaker of the language. Also adds to the realism and immersion of it. I can't watch WWII films where all the Germans and French speak English. With an English accent probably.

Using skill points to learn a language after a couple minutes seems like a stretch