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Thestreetuluv
25th Mar 2014, 21:23
Are we able to earn chests through playing matches yet?

WhiteFlameKyo
25th Mar 2014, 21:37
Yup, I got some. You need a key to open them though.

0Exroath0
25th Mar 2014, 22:36
I got one today .. but it doesnt tell you what it contains .. so im not sure if I want to open it or not

Prime_Abstergo
26th Mar 2014, 09:57
I got one today .. but it doesnt tell you what it contains .. so im not sure if I want to open it or not I agree. It says nothing. Neither about a quality of the item, nor their quantity. Hence the probability to get poor RNG side-grade (like -5% reload lol) item for 500 RS is just not acceptable IMO.

PencileyePirate
26th Mar 2014, 10:23
I agree. It says nothing. Neither about a quality of the item, nor their quantity. Hence the probability to get poor RNG side-grade (like -5% reload lol) item for 500 RS is just not acceptable IMO.

Yea I agree, I'll probably end up deleting them if the key cost doesn't get converted to gold.

Prime_Abstergo
26th Mar 2014, 10:48
the key cost doesn't get converted to gold. THIS is actually a brilliant idea.
I suggest to put price at 1500 gold per key.

pupex_calin
26th Mar 2014, 12:28
Why would you pay 1500 for a key that MAY get you what you want when you can spend exactly 1500 to get EXACTLY what you want?

Prime_Abstergo
26th Mar 2014, 14:09
Why would you pay 1500 for a key that MAY get you what you want when you can spend exactly 1500 to get EXACTLY what you want? Because that is too good to be truth :D

WhiteFlameKyo
26th Mar 2014, 14:14
Why would you pay 1500 for a key that MAY get you what you want when you can spend exactly 1500 to get EXACTLY what you want?

Weapons/abilities from chests have additional stats (+8% x, -5% y), while those from the store don't.

Ygdrasel
26th Mar 2014, 22:11
Chests earned from gameplay, yet the keys cannot be bought with in-game coin...Seems rather odd to me. I got a chest but I frankly couldn't care to spend real cash on a key. Anyone want it? =P

symbolater
27th Mar 2014, 21:35
i had 8 boxes drop in 10 games and the price of keys is a joke. i think it needed changing.

Razaiim
28th Mar 2014, 00:07
Yeah with the frequency of chest drops, opening them would become ludicrously expensive, with out a cost adjustment, or another method of acquiring keys, perhaps as an item drop instead of a skill or chest, so that impatient players can just buy the key, but people that aren't too worried can play and if they find a key then they can crack the chest open.

0Exroath0
28th Mar 2014, 01:48
Its not just the price that puts me off .. its more not knowing what im paying for .. sure it could be rare but if its got a timer on it i'll be pissed, I still wish there was some hint at whats in them.

I love the game but everything is stupidly expensive.. Which I can see damaging the player base long term..

Razaiim
28th Mar 2014, 04:51
Its not just the price that puts me off .. its more not knowing what im paying for .. sure it could be rare but if its got a timer on it i'll be pissed, I still wish there was some hint at whats in them.

I love the game but everything is stupidly expensive.. Which I can see damaging the player base long term..

These chests are going to contain modified versions of skills to use in the game. The timer only ticks while actually using them in a match (having them equipped in the current loadout of the class you are using). Once the timer wears off, the modified stats disappear , leaving the base item, until you pay a gold fee to recharge it, and I believe there was consideration for paying a runestone fee to give the item a permanent charge.

Just to ease concerns about the lifetime of the item that you will find.

Prime_Abstergo
28th Mar 2014, 08:47
These chests are going to contain modified versions of skills to use in the game. BTW are you talking about weapons/special abilities? Have you seen a chest drop contained a Secondary or Tertiary uncommon abilities?

If these are only special abilities or weapons then .. well, we can get a plenty as after-game treasures

RainaAudron
28th Mar 2014, 10:50
BTW are you talking about weapons/special abilities? Have you seen a chest drop contained a Secondary or Tertiary uncommon abilities?

As far as I have seen it contains only special abilities and weapons.

Razaiim
28th Mar 2014, 14:48
As far as I have seen it contains only special abilities and weapons.

Kind of a shame really. I feel the system is only a hop skip and a jump from being phenomenal. Allowing secondary and tertiary skills to drop (hop), as well as making mods more impactful (skip), and including class or skill related mods (mods which affect the skill rather than general stats) (more of a leap than a jump) would lend greatly to player and play style diversity.
Example: might see 2 reaver specced out with Savage, choking haze and shadow step
One might stack his skills out to be slightly better at brawling with higher attack speed and the bonus damage after a kill, taking reduced damage from self aoe, and raised stopping power, but with lower climb speed, reduced regen delay, and shorter range shadow step

The other is the opposite. He wants to hit and run so higher move speed, faster cooldowns, a Higher pouncr speed (in air) on Savage, wider explosion radius on haze preserved momentum with shadow step, but less health and less stopping power, longer charge time on shadow step, less aoe damage from staying in haze area etc...

There is just so much potential in the number of variables psyonix has beyond general stats.

JansKyGTX
28th Mar 2014, 16:00
So I got a sentinel chest from a round, and i just wanna understand wtf is the point of it if i have to buy a key in order to get what's inside... Unless someone could help me out and tell me that there's another way of getting the key

RainaAudron
28th Mar 2014, 16:54
No, you have to buy one - it is a similar system to TF2 where you have to buy keys to open chests.

Psyonix_Corey
28th Mar 2014, 17:29
Kind of a shame really. I feel the system is only a hop skip and a jump from being phenomenal. Allowing secondary and tertiary skills to drop (hop), as well as making mods more impactful (skip), and including class or skill related mods (mods which affect the skill rather than general stats) (more of a leap than a jump) would lend greatly to player and play style diversity.
Example: might see 2 reaver specced out with Savage, choking haze and shadow step
One might stack his skills out to be slightly better at brawling with higher attack speed and the bonus damage after a kill, taking reduced damage from self aoe, and raised stopping power, but with lower climb speed, reduced regen delay, and shorter range shadow step

The other is the opposite. He wants to hit and run so higher move speed, faster cooldowns, a Higher pouncr speed (in air) on Savage, wider explosion radius on haze preserved momentum with shadow step, but less health and less stopping power, longer charge time on shadow step, less aoe damage from staying in haze area etc...

There is just so much potential in the number of variables psyonix has beyond general stats.

We don't consider it done. Secondary/tertiaries with stats are coming once we have the time to implement them. There are also cosmetic effects coming but the new classes have taken precedence.

Further, I discovered a bug causing chests to drop way too often.

I will speak with Square about the chest/key stuff. My inclination is to disable locked chest drops and key sales until the UI for charged items is clearer (so you don't think they're going to go away like a rental), and until we can offer more variety / more compelling magic items.

GenFeelGood
28th Mar 2014, 17:45
We don't consider it done. Secondary/tertiaries with stats are coming once we have the time to implement them. There are also cosmetic effects coming but the new classes have taken precedence.

Exciting, any hints you can give us on the new classes or possibly a general ETA for their reveal, PLEASE!!!!?

Deltajugg
29th Mar 2014, 00:23
What hurts me the most with the chests is that it's like I'm being pushed all the time to make this game non-f2p. Of course, I'm okay with some cash earned customisation options, even skills that are available for everyone, but someone's in a hurry so he pays for them. What I'm not okay is filling my inventory with pay2open chests, instead of perks and abilities previously granted for playing. This chest drop - buy key is something I recognise from MMOs like Neverwinter, and I really don't like seeing it in here. Of course you can still play the game for free, but earning the same with hard work what one can purchase is non-existant if all cool items are now locked up for money. And this game is still in Closed Beta, because of my financial limitations I almost never spend cash on such things as cosmetics in free games, but, I may be oldschool with that, I'd especially never pay for something in a game during closed beta, and I really don't think that cash shop should be the highest priority for a game still in making.
The current chest system in this game is something I really despise, it feels like the first step into a grim future with potentially free games, but ideas like annoying pop-ups in the game lobby covering 90% of your screen and annoying music, and a message "Use 3500 runestones to remove annoying pop-ups from the game".

0Exroath0
29th Mar 2014, 02:50
We don't consider it done. Secondary/tertiaries with stats are coming once we have the time to implement them. There are also cosmetic effects coming but the new classes have taken precedence.

Further, I discovered a bug causing chests to drop way too often.

I will speak with Square about the chest/key stuff. My inclination is to disable locked chest drops and key sales until the UI for charged items is clearer (so you don't think they're going to go away like a rental), and until we can offer more variety / more compelling magic items.

Why sell something that isnt ready? Why are you happy to sell an unfinished product? yes its closed beta but your still taking money... Honestly this worrys me alot , so much so that what ever the result of this is will be the deciding factor of whether I keep this installed or remove it ..

Again.. the game I love , your store however .. other than the skins it feels like a rip off.

Inrezairo
29th Mar 2014, 21:40
I have 3 chests at the moment meaning 1500 RS to open them that means at least £6.00 to get enough runestones and I would only have enough RS for one more chest after that.

This is too much, please consider dropping the cost down to maybe 100 RS or 250 RS to make them a more desirable prospect.

Zenneh
30th Mar 2014, 10:48
I'm fine with Chests, I'm fine with cash bought keys, But I am not a fan of my entire inventory being filled to the brim with Chests in my past 20 matches I've gained 9 Chests and with no end being seen in sight. Granted their blue background is relaxing on the eyes...
Now before you say you can delete the chests - until they develop a way to delete multiple items at the same time I feel that doing that is a waste of time as I'm currently sitting on 17 Chests at the moment.
Other band-aid fixes could be:-
1. Be able to get keys for gold - maybe 2000 gold - since you're getting something with stats
2. Raise quality of chest items decrease their drop rate but have their keys at same price with no gold keys
3. Have an extremely low chance of keys being found at end of match and also lower the chances of getting a chest so finding them is a rarity.

0Exroath0
30th Mar 2014, 13:53
Honestly I would be fine with the keys staying the same price if the item in the chest could justify it.

Opening a chest to fined an item that has stats that completely gimp you angers me to no end. The debuff should never be higher than the buff imo, Currently I have 3 items I will never used to to them basically worse than the basic item. (1 from chest 2 from level bags)

What about cursed weapons or something from lore.. Have the chests contain things truely unavailable on the store.
Weapons that give reaver like effects, say your arm connects to the weapon in some way and depending on the reaver it has a special stat? Life steal, poison , fire damage etc.

Also you could have skins be an extremely rare drop and then also have a special version only available from chests with an ubsurd drop rate.

Theres so so much that these chests could offer that would allow them to be worth the high cost of keys , but atm .. its a rippoff/exploit of you player base. Which I believe is an extemely dangerous practice in closed beta.

Honestly anything beats the current chests atm. I've had far better random drops than anything I've seen people open from chests

MordaxPraetorian
30th Mar 2014, 13:58
The debuff should never be higher than the buff imo

The debuff should always be at least equivalent to the buff otherwise people can gain an unfair advantage by paying

Free to Play is a business model where everyone wins if implemented correctly

Pay to Win is unacceptable and as players, particularly as beta testers we have a duty not to encourage developers to allow people to buy power that free players have no access to

0Exroath0
2nd Apr 2014, 13:58
The debuff should always be at least equivalent to the buff otherwise people can gain an unfair advantage by paying

Free to Play is a business model where everyone wins if implemented correctly

Pay to Win is unacceptable and as players, particularly as beta testers we have a duty not to encourage developers to allow people to buy power that free players have no access to

Im not saying I want the buff to be powerful, Just equal to the debuff, Say I lose reload speed by 2% but gain firing speed by2% instead of 2% reload for -6% firing speed etc.

MordaxPraetorian
2nd Apr 2014, 17:52
Im not saying I want the buff to be powerful, Just equal to the debuff, Say I lose reload speed by 2% but gain firing speed by2% instead of 2% reload for -6% firing speed etc.

The attributes aren't numerically equal in terms of the benefit that they give though

lets say you got a vampire item that gave +5% wall climbing speed and -5% ground movement speed. Climbing speed only helps you in the specific situation that you are climbing a wall, while the debuff to ground movement hinders you at most points through the match. Would that feel like a fair item? Would the reverse (+5% ground movement for -5% wall climbing speed) feel fair to your opponents?

Prime_Abstergo
3rd Apr 2014, 07:08
0Exroath0, there are as many useless combos as good ones. E.g. the kidnap I've got from lvling, had following stats:
+2% attack speed
-2% movement speed (not flying!)

+5% attack speed +5% movement speed
+6% CD ability for 5 sec after killing an enemy

Still there a question may be raised: WHY some bonuses are MUCH MORE better then others?
And some cons are a real pain:
-10% wall climbing speed (for tyrant)
-8% damage when under 33% HP
-6% ability CD
-15% healing from shrines
-10% stopping power resist (for sentinel)
-10% stun resist (terrible for any human)

0Exroath0
3rd Apr 2014, 21:18
I'll screeny my weapons to explain.. Will take a day or two .. pump just failed so waiting on a replacement.