PDA

View Full Version : Batman Crashing? Have the Steam version?



Leapo
20th Oct 2009, 20:22
I, like many others, have been having numerous issues with Batman locking up and crashing at random. After pouring over huge volumes of information in an attempt to solve my problems, I stumbled upon an interesting tidbit of information.

The Steam version has additional SecuROM protection, while the DVD version and the demo do not.

I remembered I had tried the demo of Arkhma Asylum previously without any of these crashing issues. This got me thinking, what if SecuROM was to blame for all these problems people are having (not Games for Windows Live, as some have assumed).

I called up a friend who had purchased the DVD version and borrowed the disc from him. I installed it, logged into my Games for Windows Live profile, and started playing. Guess what?

Not a single crash.

There is some sort of horrible SecuROM issue in the Steam version that's causing these issues. I would hazard a guess that 90% of the people complaining here about crashes are Steam users. Anybody else care to share your experiences?

darkwoof
21st Oct 2009, 05:33
Nope, a Steam user and not a single crash. I've completed the main game once, in the middle of my second run through, and completed all the challenge maps, including the DLC.

There was a poll previously, think it is abandoned. The poll wasn't about whether users were using a Steam or Retail release, but about frequent crashes and video cards. At last glance it did show that more Nvidia users were experiencing significantly more frequent crashes as opposed to ATI users.

Anyway, IIRC, both the retail and Steam release of BAA contains SecuROM, but utilises it in different ways. The Steam version utilises the activation limit aspect of it, whereas the retail version utilises the disc check aspect of it.

deders
21st Oct 2009, 05:35
which OS's are you both using?

Leapo
21st Oct 2009, 11:28
Nope, a Steam user and not a single crash. I've completed the main game once, in the middle of my second run through, and completed all the challenge maps, including the DLC.
Hay, I never said it wasn't possible for a Steam user to play the game perfectly. Just that it's easier to irritate SecuROM on the Steam version. Don't be so dismissive...


Anyway, IIRC, both the retail and Steam release of BAA contains SecuROM, but utilises it in different ways. The Steam version utilises the activation limit aspect of it, whereas the retail version utilises the disc check aspect of it.
There are bigger differences than that.

The Steam version uses SecuROM to instate a 4-activations-per-month policy. It also watchdogs every system resource the game loads, if anything is found that it thinks is out of place, the game crashes. Most disturbingly, these crashes aren't displayed as being generated by SecuROM, they're displayed as general protection faults, making legit customers think that the game is buggy when it's the draconian DRM causing their problems.

The DVD version of the game, on the other hand, uses SecuROM for a simple DVD check, and that is all.

I've tested this personally. I created a slightly modified d3d9.dll and put it into the game's "binaries" folder. The DVD version of the game ran fine with the modification, the Steam version crashed instantly.

lawsie
21st Oct 2009, 12:00
im a steam user and i only tend to get the baa shipping error when i die 50% of the time, but only with high physx on though.

darkwoof
21st Oct 2009, 12:48
Hay, I never said it wasn't possible for a Steam user to play the game perfectly. Just that it's easier to irritate SecuROM on the Steam version. Don't be so dismissive...

You sounded pretty sure that it's the SecuROM on the Steam release that causes the problems, and I'm just telling you that it may not necessarily be it. If you're a frequent browser at the Steampowered forums, you'd see that often times, whether SecuROM was present or not, people have encountered problems with Steam versions when things had worked fine with retail. So while SecuROM can be a culprit at times, it may not always be the case. If you're unaware, Steam released games files are often modified from their retail release, and are quite intolerant of modifications. They may be the cause of your GPFs.

As for my answer being "Dismissive", I don't know where you got that from. You said you guessed that 90% of crashes are Steam users, and asked for comments. So being a Steam user and having read that many Steam users had it working fine, I decided to spent some time to let you know that my experiences were different. Being a little sensitive don't you think? You know what, forget it, I'll just try not to "infringe" upon your theories next time.

Leapo
21st Oct 2009, 13:30
You sounded pretty sure that it's the SecuROM on the Steam release that causes the problems, and I'm just telling you that it may not necessarily be it. If you're a frequent browser at the Steampowered forums, you'd see that often times, whether SecuROM was present or not, people have encountered problems with Steam versions when things had worked fine with retail. So while SecuROM can be a culprit at times, it may not always be the case. If you're unaware, Steam released games files are often modified from their retail release, and are quite intolerant of modifications. They may be the cause of your GPFs.
I'm well aware of how Steam works, but the more I poke around, the more I'm sure it's SecuROM causing these issues with Batman.

Case in point, I replaced the Steam version of bmstartapp.exe (this is the SecuROM launcher that starts ShippingPC-BmGame.exe) with one that had SecuROM stripped out. It now loads my custom d3d9.dll just fine, just like the DVD release of the game.

This means a simple update to DirectX could break the Steam version of batman, causing crashes and lockups. I am now dead certain that SecuROM is to blame for a large portion problems users are experiencing.

deders
21st Oct 2009, 14:11
im a steam user and i only tend to get the baa shipping error when i die 50% of the time, but only with high physx on though.

you told me it was fine for you, when did it start crashing? after the first play through?

deders
21st Oct 2009, 14:17
I had a theory (and a poll, i'll bump it) because I'd played through the game both in XP32 and Vista64, and although performance was better in XP, it was the only time it ever crashed, with exactly the same settings. the poll showed that nobody who visited with Vista or Vista64 had any crash problems, only people with XP or 7. Of course this was only intended to show resullts for people suffering from the crash when you die or go back to menu.

Leapo
21st Oct 2009, 14:35
I had a theory (and a poll, i'll bump it) because I'd played through the game both in XP32 and Vista64, and although performance was better in XP, it was the only time it ever crashed, with exactly the same settings. the poll showed that nobody who visited with Vista or Vista64 had any crash problems, only people with XP or 7. Of course this was only intended to show resullts for people suffering from the crash when you die or go back to menu.
Hmm, now there's an interesting idea.

If SecuROM has "locked in" the specific DLL versions included with Windows Vista, older versions of these libraries present in Windows XP, and newer versions present in Windows 7, would cause fairly repeatable crashes when specific sections of code that differ from SecuROM's expected versions are encountered at runtime.

This would, again, only effect the Steam version of Arkham Asylum, as the DVD version does no such checks.

deders
21st Oct 2009, 14:39
This would, again, only effect the Steam version of Arkham Asylum, as the DVD version does no such checks.

Well I've got the DVD version

Leapo
21st Oct 2009, 14:41
Well I've got the DVD version
If you're having crashes with the DVD versions, it's most likely a different issue...though you could always try what I did with the Steam version, replace bmstartapp.exe with a "fixed" version that has SecuROM stripped out to see if the game stops crashing.

If that fixes the DVD version for you, then there's something even stranger going on...


Edit/Disclaimer: I do not condone nor promote piracy or warez, everything being discussed here is in the interest of tracking down why so many people are having issues with this game. All tests and modifications have been done on legally purchased versions of the game.

deders
21st Oct 2009, 15:43
If you're having crashes with the DVD versions, it's most likely a different issue...

ok, so which crashes are you talking about specifically
also what OS are you using?

Leapo
21st Oct 2009, 16:01
ok, so which crashes are you talking about specifically?
Any crash, I've had them all. Crashing while going through doors, while exiting the map screen, when dieing. These crashes usually look like the screenshot below, but sometimes the screen will simply freeze (bringing up the task manager and killing the game is the only way to get out of it)

http://kimag.es/share/28235369.png

What type of crashes are you experiencing with the DVD version? I havn't had a single crash running the DVD version, nor have I had a crash running the Steam version with SecuROM ripped out.


What OS are you using?
I'm using Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit

deders
21st Oct 2009, 16:13
Well so far it sometimes crashes when I die (just before the awesome gloating scenes) or return to the menu. most annoying when doing challenges and I have to restart the game to do another challenge. but this only happens sometimes, and only when I'm playing on XP. But playing on XP makes it much smoother for me.

The filename not found errors look similar, maybe not the same, as the errors that people with the D2D version had when they patched the game using the g4wl version of the patch. I still refer people to the patch in the one of the sticky threads on this forum to solve a lot of issues so g4wl must still b using the old patch. I guess it would be harder for a Steam user to know whether their patch was overwriting files properly, or even fix it with a different patch.

Leapo
21st Oct 2009, 16:45
The filename not found errors look similar, maybe not the same, as the errors that people with the D2D version had when they patched the game using the g4wl version of the patch. I still refer people to the patch in the one of the sticky threads on this forum to solve a lot of issues so g4wl must still b using the old patch. I guess it would be harder for a Steam user to know whether their patch was overwriting files properly, or even fix it with a different patch.
The error window usually looks similar to that screenshot, but the game seems to throw all kinds of different error messages in it depending on its mood. That was just one example.

This isn't a patching problem, at least that's not what I'm seeing. Replacing ONLY the SecuROM launcher in the Steam version of the game fixes all the crashes for me instantly. That means the game files and game executable are perfectly fine.

deders
21st Oct 2009, 16:46
good point