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boake
18th Sep 2009, 11:31
Is there a way to apply the physics to dead bodies? It's so lame to walk through dead bodies.
I think the physics MUST be applied to dead bodies to make the game a lot better.
The only thing which I have noticed so far has physics is a paper. Frankly speaking, you should've applied the physics to dead bodies, not to papers.
Let me ask you again. Is there a workaround to apply the physics to dead bodies?

Rockatansky
18th Sep 2009, 12:20
No chance of that happening.
And there's a difference between ingame physics and PhysX content.
The PhysX content was developed by nVidia and is an enhancement to the game which can be switched on or off.

boake
18th Sep 2009, 12:58
Nvidia or not, their decision was totally wrong. Most of the recent games, even budget games, have dead body phisics. Without it, the game feels so unfinished and rushed. I can't believe the big game like this don't have the dead body physics. Come on, developer, you should make an urgent patch to make it available.

capable heart
18th Sep 2009, 16:19
It's not that Rocksteady CAN'T make dead or unconscious bodies moveable. There is another possibility.

It order for the game not to go above a "Teen" rating (or whatever it is outside North America where I am) you can't have dead bodies as moveable. The game is already quite violent and if you could mess around with the corpses then it might increase the game's rating.

It's also not really necessary because Batman would never do that anyway.

Moleculor
18th Sep 2009, 17:13
It's not a "decision". They couldn't do that level of physics on the consoles, so they didn't program it. When it was going to go to PC, Nvidia came along and ADDED IN content (paper, breakable walls, fog, etc). They didn't change content (like bodies).

SteMot
18th Sep 2009, 17:22
Without it, the game feels so unfinished and rushed.

That is the most ridiculous statement I have heard for a while. A game which has had so much care and attention paid to the beautiful environments, the smooth and unparalleled combat system, stealth techniques, voice work, texture work, replayability and imaginative level design has been rushed because you cannot move a corpse with your feet?

Are you for real? Talk about priority's. :D

Nemesis296
18th Sep 2009, 17:26
Is there a way to apply the physics to dead bodies? It's so lame to walk through dead bodies.


So you would rather that Batman trip over bodies when walking in the game, or maim the bodies even further probably warranting an M rating instead of T?

I mean I love realistic games, but it's like you're saying that this game sucks because you won't trip on bodies...

Like other posters said, you can turn the PhysX off if you don't want it, and you didn't have to pay anything extra to use it either :rolleyes:

Moleculor
18th Sep 2009, 17:33
I will admit that the bodies (at least in the demo, as I don't have the full game) do leave something of a sense of... distaste... in my mouth. Brain. Whatever. They all seem to die in the same positiion: Hands floating two inches off of their scalp, as if they're holding an invisible helmet to their head.

With the amazingly detailed environments, etc, this one bit of unimmersive graphical oddity is glaringly obvious.

deders
18th Sep 2009, 17:36
Is there a way to apply the physics to dead bodies? It's so lame to walk through dead bodies.
I think the physics MUST be applied to dead bodies to make the game a lot better.
The only thing which I have noticed so far has physics is a paper. Frankly speaking, you should've applied the physics to dead bodies, not to papers.
Let me ask you again. Is there a workaround to apply the physics to dead bodies?

I've played the game with physx both on and off and I can confirm there is a difference in the bodies, if anything they are more realistic without Physx as they can be prone being bent in impossible ways and spazzing out like the old ragdolls used to.

pleomax
18th Sep 2009, 17:38
I must admit in gears of war for pc, i loved how you moved the bodys if you walked into them.

They could have done it.

Nemesis296
18th Sep 2009, 17:57
I must admit in gears of war for pc, i loved how you moved the bodys if you walked into them.

They could have done it.

Gears of War is MUCH much different. M rated game, so the concept of "dragging" a body on the ground is much more understandable. You could say the same thing about Batman's batarang to the chainsaw on the Lancer..."Why doesn't it cut thug's arms off!!?" I'm sure this is because of the T rating...

Zagadka
18th Sep 2009, 17:58
I don't think it is a feature worth the effort. Most games with physical corpses (like Fallout 3) just look silly when you walk over them, they bounce around and juggle... looks stupid.

Paulley
18th Sep 2009, 21:58
i was just hoping maybe you could drag bodies or move them... also do ya think the guards come take the thugs away cus they cant stay unconscious forever (unless batman made them all comatose) Batman needs to get his Batcuffs out or these guys are gonna be an annoyance when i walk back through the levels ;)

boake
18th Sep 2009, 22:55
Come on, face the reality. Dead body physics is a BIG part of nvidia physx ragdoll, the lack of which means the physics system of this game is definitely half-baked.
If they couldn't make the dead bodies movable for the rating issue or any other absurd and implausible reasons, they should've at least make them become vaporized or something.

Zagadka
18th Sep 2009, 23:43
i was just hoping maybe you could drag bodies or move them... also do ya think the guards come take the thugs away cus they cant stay unconscious

Can you say... grappling hook?


Come on, face the reality. Dead body physics is a BIG part of nvidia physx ragdoll, the lack of which means the physics system of this game is definitely half-baked.
If they couldn't make the dead bodies movable for the rating issue or any other absurd and implausible reasons, they should've at least make them become vaporized or something.
Well, they turn into a bat swarm :-p

You haveto think as a developer: "does this add anything to the project"... kicking around bodies adds nothing but extra work and more complexity. And as I said, most attempts at ragdoll dead bodies just look stupid as you kick them down the hall.

boake
19th Sep 2009, 00:20
Then what's the point of implementing the physics to this game? Do they really think we will scream "WOW!!!! That's FANTASTIC!!!! I can't believe my eyes!!!!" when we see the papers moving? The paper alone is never enough to satisfy our eyes. The game needs dead body ragdoll to satisfy our eyes.
Although some people disagree, dead body ragdoll does add MUCH to the game; it makes the game a lot more realistic and natural, and it is one of the most interesting factors in games with full physics.
So, what's the conclusion? Batman is the game with utterly hyped fake physics. It's so disappointing.

Zagadka
19th Sep 2009, 00:34
Then what's the point of implementing the physics to this game?

Some physics are useful or immersive. Kicking bodies around just looks silly and adds absolutely nothing.

The_Hylden
19th Sep 2009, 01:14
And these are still live people, NOT DEAD BODIES. Why would Batman go kicking around live people when they're already unconscious?

boake
19th Sep 2009, 02:47
Unconscious or dead, whatever. They are lying on the ground, aren't they? :rolleyes:

shevanel77
19th Sep 2009, 06:09
anything "physx by nvidia" sucks period.

havok/ati based physix FTW

euphoria 2nd

oseven
19th Sep 2009, 06:25
anything "physx by nvidia" sucks period.

havok/ati based physix FTW

euphoria 2nd
Troll



On topic though... I would bet that the decision to not make the bodies movable was based on Batman's "Never Kill" mentality. If you could move the bodies, it would allow you to roll unconscious people down stairs, cliffs, roofs, or balconies. An action that would surely kill in many situations.

The Coca Cola Company
19th Sep 2009, 06:49
anything "physx by nvidia" sucks period.

havok/ati based physix FTW

euphoria 2nd

And you tell us this because you come from the future and you have seen the havok GPU accelerated physics right? :lol:

Or maybe you've seen how "great" GTA IV (who is the only PC title that uses Euphoria) runs on the PC... :lmao:

http://www.google.com/search?q=gta+iv+worst+port

The_Hylden
19th Sep 2009, 07:46
Unconscious or dead, whatever. They are lying on the ground, aren't they? :rolleyes:

And as the REST OF MY POST STATED, Batman would NOT kick an unconscious person. That's not who he is. What you want goes against the character, as others have already stated.

boake
19th Sep 2009, 08:22
I would bet that the decision to not make the bodies movable was based on Batman's "Never Kill" mentality.
Batman killed people.
http://quickstopentertainment.com/comics101/images/2003/nov26/killing.jpg
http://quickstopentertainment.com/comics101/images/2004/jan21/strangling.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v619/Ratso/batman_cossack.jpg

Deva
19th Sep 2009, 09:13
Batman killed people.
http://quickstopentertainment.com/comics101/images/2003/nov26/killing.jpg
http://quickstopentertainment.com/comics101/images/2004/jan21/strangling.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v619/Ratso/batman_cossack.jpg

HEADSHOT!!! This guy owned the tread!
Btw there is hardly any remarkable physics what where we waiting for? just for some papers? come on I was waiting for something more

boake
19th Sep 2009, 10:52
Btw there is hardly any remarkable physics what where we waiting for? just for some papers? come on I was waiting for something more
We were deceived by big hype. It doesn't have even the destructible pillars shown in demo.

The_Hylden
19th Sep 2009, 13:04
Batman "killing" 70 years ago when created, the "Golden Age" that's not the origin of the current Batman, along this 'verse. Bringing it up makes no sense, nor does this complaining.

If this is really so upsetting, the physics not being up to you, or now Dev's, standards, why don't you both return the game and ask for you money back? I doubt Rocksteady will be hurt at all at your loss.

boake
19th Sep 2009, 14:03
Bringing it up makes no sense, nor does this complaining.
Nor does mindless fanboyism. As one of the unsatisfied consumers, I DO have a right to complain about the game I paid for.

The_Hylden
19th Sep 2009, 14:19
Mindless fanboyism has nothing to do with it. You've spent two pages complaining over not being able to kick a body on the ground as grounds you haven't gotten your money's worth. Ridiculous doesn't even cover it.

Complaint has been registered. Restating it over and over seems to be your only intent now, ignoring all points that aren't convenient to the complaint, which is nothing but spam. There are ALWAYS these silly threads that pop up when a new game comes out, no matter how good, or bad. But especially the better the game, the more ridiculous these complaints become.

Good day to you.

Ballbag
19th Sep 2009, 14:43
Mindless fanboyism has nothing to do with it. You've spent two pages complaining over not being able to kick a body on the ground as grounds you haven't gotten your money's worth. Ridiculous doesn't even cover it.

Complaint has been registered. Restating it over and over seems to be your only intent now, ignoring all points that aren't convenient to the complaint, which is nothing but spam. There are ALWAYS these silly threads that pop up when a new game comes out, no matter how good, or bad. But especially the better the game, the more ridiculous these complaints become.

Good day to you.

Wow :) I am with you sir :thumb:

Deva
19th Sep 2009, 16:00
I don't care about not being able to kick a body on the ground i personally was waiting for something more as there was a 1 month delay for those so remarkable physics and i am not seeing them anywhere it doesn't really mater i like the game i am just curious about what where we waiting for ?

The Coca Cola Company
19th Sep 2009, 17:13
http://www.nvidia.com/object/io_1249628711830.html

This is what we were waiting for:

With PhysX technology enabled, players can explore darkened corridors packed with volumetric fog which reacts to Batman’s movement and cobwebs which tear with his passing. Combat becomes a maelstrom of motion as office papers are thrown into the air alongside soda cans and litter as Batman lands each punch upon The Joker’s henchmen. Throughout the game, the decaying gothic architecture is realized to an incredible detail with wall tiles chipping and breaking, stone pillars crumbling upon impact, and particles from breaking glass and debris shattering and falling down around Batman’s feet.

and this is exactly what we got.

boake
19th Sep 2009, 23:09
stone pillars crumbling upon impac
That's a sheer lie.
I beat the game and haven't seen a single stone pillar crumbling upon impact.
Let alone the dead body physics, they didn't include even the feature they officially advertised.
What a shame. :cool:

Deva
19th Sep 2009, 23:13
and this is exactly what we got.

Are you sure about that?

The Coca Cola Company
20th Sep 2009, 01:13
That's a sheer lie.
I beat the game and haven't seen a single stone pillar crumbling upon impact.
Let alone the dead body physics, they didn't include even the feature they officially advertised.
What a shame. :cool:

I think your batarang does damage to them.

boake
20th Sep 2009, 03:09
I think your batarang does damage to them.
Are you kidding? Have you even played it?
Or are you one of the mindless fanboys who don't accept even the obvious fact?

The_Hylden
20th Sep 2009, 20:16
You are a troll. You obviously haven't even played it. I just got my copy yesterday and have been playing it since. Oh, and the pillars? CocaColaCompany up there is totally correct. Your batarang breaks off chunks of them, just like in the demo... Batman's fists do not break them up anymore, unless a harder strike from a combo while fighting will do it. But, I haven't tried that. Could it be that, gasp, they don't have Batman breaking concrete pillars apart with his fists to make it more realistic??

Everything else happens just as it did in the demo. Cobwebs and banners float and wave realistically. Volumetric fog you can pass through and it surrounds you.Not only a few bits of paper on the ground, but stacks of paper you can mess up from on the desks, on the floor. Leaves outside fall realistically about from the trees, or are brushed up from the bushes if you run through. Tiles break apart in certain areas from either your batarang, or by landing hard after a glide attack, or when they tear themselves from the walls in a certain area. I've seen glass shards, sparks, debris from the walls and from Bane tossing chunks of the room you fight him in at you stay on the ground, soda cans from a certain level's trash cans fall around you. PhysX is doing everything and more from the demo. Now, you pop back on here challenging anything I've just stated and I will know for certain you both haven't played the game and are nothing but a troll trying to stir up attention for yourself.

If you acknowledge all I've said and that still isn't supposedly enough for you to have in the game, then beyond the above, you could also simply be someone who pleasing them would be impossible. Either way, it's not worth the time it would take to respond to. BUT, for the record, this is all PhysX is doing for Arkham. I started playing the game without the patch, so without PhysX and man, what a difference! Without the fog and the paper and the sparks and everything, it still plays great and has a lot of atmosphere, but it can have so much more and should be played with PhysX on, if your system can handle it.

Fantastic game thus far :thumb:

thetonyg
20th Sep 2009, 20:27
That's a sheer lie.
I beat the game and haven't seen a single stone pillar crumbling upon impact.
Let alone the dead body physics, they didn't include even the feature they officially advertised.
What a shame. :cool:

Actually, there is at least one place where stone pillars crumble on impact, but it's not user controlled. I know for certain because I intentionally killed myself to go back to the checkpoint to view that scene over again w/ FRAPs on.

It's during one of the Scarecrow "hide from the gaze" levels with the giant Scarecrow in the middle. There's a lot of whirling stone debris flowing around 'Crow and at one point in the middle of the level more debris comes flying from offscene toward the pillars and wall, and you see the entire wall come crumbling down into smallish bricks that then get sucked in toward 'Crow.

I have at least 100 full 1080p clips I took during awe-inspiring moments inside the game and could locate this one, downrez, compress, etc., find a way to post if you don't believe me, but it's definitely there. My rig dipped to about 25fps, about the lowest it's seen in the game ever, so I suspect PhysX was hard at work.

Finally, since the overall scene was relatively simple and my rig did dive to 25fps, I am going to speculate that perhaps this is why other crumbling effects were not more pervasive throughout the game -- it slowed computers down too much to put it everywhere. Again, just speculation.

boake
20th Sep 2009, 21:00
Your batarang breaks off chunks of them, just like in the demo...
Like I said, I haven't seen a single pillar which can be crumbled by batman's fist or any weapons.
They clearly said in their advertisement, that the pillar can be broken on impact, and it's so natural for us to expect that all the pillars in the game can be broken by player.
But as I mentioned in my previous post, I already beat the game. So I uninstalled it and don't want to reinstall it just to check whether your insistence is true or not.
To make your point, show me the proof. Show me at least 3 spots where you can break the pillar with batarang. Then it will be proved that some pillars can be broken by batarang.


Actually, there is at least one place where stone pillars crumble on impact, but it's not user controlled.
I am talking about the pillar which can be crumbled by player.

thetonyg
20th Sep 2009, 21:34
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I understand that, and I understand your frustration. I don't think that dead body physics was the best way to get your point across since it does sound.... well, I don't know... out of context. But the truth is the software industry (games or otherwise) is riddled with these kinds of let downs. I can't count how many times a company has said that something would be included in a game or other software, and it's either absent or it's just not there to the degree I expected. It sucks, but there's not much you can do about it.

The only "fix" is to keep a leash on the marketing hype machine until the developer is absolutely certain that a feature can be delivered as described and on time. Having been a software developer, and now leading a team of software developers, I know how these things go. Sometimes a feature that seems trivial in concept ends up being ridiculously difficult in practice due to an unforeseen complexity that came up during development. The opposite is also true (features that seem complex but end up being trivial). It sucks, but it IS part of the software development game, and marketers should know better than to trump up something that is risky. NOTE: I say this without having followed Batman AA until just before release, so I really don't know what went out in press releases, interviews, etc. -- so maybe the problem was not what was communicated by the company, but rather, individual interpretation of what was communicated, which would not be a marketer's fault.

Regardless, PhysX works great in this game and I think that Batman AA should get game of the year this year. It's fantastic in every other way. More environmental destruction and physics would have been nicer, but I really enjoyed the fact that I could play this game on full at 1080p on a huge display with silky smooth framerates almost all the time.

boake
20th Sep 2009, 21:52
Well, it has a decent gameplay. But the problem is they promised us what they couldn't keep.
In big games like this, it's no wonder we expect what they promised will be truthfully implemented.
When we realize that their promise was nothing but a hype which doesn't conform to our expectation, we feel deceived by them. That's what disappoints us the most.

The_Hylden
20th Sep 2009, 22:57
Replay it again. It's in the first level, for goodness sake, so it doesn't take that much to go and check for yourself, if you have the game. Toss a batarang at one of those pillars and you'll see nice solid chunks of concrete blow apart from it... -_- You might want to make sure your PhysX is set to the high setting also, not the normal setting. If the pillar legitamently does not blow apart for you, the only other reason I can think of is your card won't support the high setting on PhysX, but I believe, from what was stated, that shouldn't be the case.

The Coca Cola Company
21st Sep 2009, 05:28
Are you sure about that?

Yes. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GyKCM-Bpuw

SecretOfVampires
21st Sep 2009, 05:53
Gears of War is MUCH much different. M rated game, so the concept of "dragging" a body on the ground is much more understandable. You could say the same thing about Batman's batarang to the chainsaw on the Lancer..."Why doesn't it cut thug's arms off!!?" I'm sure this is because of the T rating...

No, because Batman doesn't kill people. After you beat the snot out of the criminals if you check their status they are only unconscious not dead.