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View Full Version : Tooobbbyyy!!!!!nnnnnnnnoooooooo!!!



hyrule12
15th Sep 2009, 00:59
today is a sad day for me...
http://www.tombraiderchronicles.com/headlines3671.html

:eek::(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:worship::worship:

John Akam
15th Sep 2009, 02:00
Ah well :hmm:

Max 28
15th Sep 2009, 03:15
Awww, that's sad. But maybe it won't be so bad without him, he didn't take TR as far as we wanted it to go when he came back. CD's trio are good but just not there yet. Hopefully they wont drop further with him gone.

Dusk Knight
15th Sep 2009, 04:40
That's a bit surprising.

I wonder who is in charge of TR9 then. Jason Botta (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/jason-botta/0/b27/b02), perhaps? His profile is closed but you can still see "Lead Designer at Crystal Dynamics". It could be out of date though. Like Crystal Dynamics (http://www.linkedin.com/companies/crystal-dynamics)' "150 employees".

Pulse
15th Sep 2009, 06:11
What did it mean by finished blah blah project??? is TR9 already very far along :eek: :scratch: :confused:

josh1122
15th Sep 2009, 06:13
What did it mean by finished blah blah project??? is TR9 already very far along :eek: :scratch: :confused:

probably means that hes finish with his role in the game.

Meaning his imput and ideas or thoughts are no longer needed since he finished those up

Natla
15th Sep 2009, 06:30
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/toby-gard/7/b6/552

Ants_27_
15th Sep 2009, 06:49
today is a sad day for me...
http://www.tombraiderchronicles.com/headlines3671.html

:eek::(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:worship::worship:

Why don't I feel surprised. I mean he wasn't going to spend all of his life on Tomb Raider was he?

When I'm sure there are other projects to unearth.:cool: But it's no problem anyway.

josh1122
15th Sep 2009, 07:00
he probably saw what was being done with TR 9 and jumped ship before it sank lol. Don't blame the guy :D

Rexie
15th Sep 2009, 08:03
http://www.vykort.com/data/media/7/party4.jpg

Bampire
15th Sep 2009, 09:39
In all Honesty, Toby left Core after TR1 was out, and they did well without him. Though unfortunately they didn't last long and people wanted more then they could give.

CD can make it without him, as Toby said. Either he left, or he was laid off, but whatever happened it wont be a terrible thing.Yes, it is unfortunate for the loss of the legendary Toby Guard, but he might come back to work on his Lara once more, like he did before.

Jurre
15th Sep 2009, 14:24
I found this picture of the young TG: Aah, isn't he cute?

http://www.eidolons-inn.net/segabase/P-TobyGard.gif

jayjay119
15th Sep 2009, 16:44
In all Honesty, Toby left Core after TR1 was out, and they did well without him. Though unfortunately they didn't last long and people wanted more then they could give.

Completely agree, he's not the be all and end all of TR games, many people cite that TR2 is their favourite game, that was the first game without him so it goes to prove that whilst nice to have him there its not really necessary.

Duckie1996
15th Sep 2009, 17:07
:( I was sad too, he is a good creator, who will come up with great Tomb Raider ideas now?

Shame :( He was my favourite creator..

Bye Toby Gard!

_Love2Raid_
15th Sep 2009, 21:05
Well, this is kind of old news...

I know some TR-fans 'hate' him, don't know why, since without Toby there wouldn't be a Lara Croft in the first place, but whatever. Good luck to him with whatever he is going to do next. :)

lilhanhan
15th Sep 2009, 21:17
:( I was sad too, he is a good creator, who will come up with great Tomb Raider ideas now?


Well, Core did fine without him for years...

I'm not saying that I'm glad he's gone, mind you; I'm just saying that I don't see why some people think it's the end of the world because he's left.

nikkinickels
15th Sep 2009, 22:01
i hope CD can do it, i wonder what toby's next project is gonna be. most importantly, i hope CD takes their time to make sure that this game is gonna be worth the wait. althought goodluck to toby and we thank him for lara :]

Pulse
15th Sep 2009, 23:01
Who came up with Legend. They were headed in the right direction for a modern TR..... then Toby and eric were hired....... and Underworld was their gift to us... kind of a disappointing sequel..

josh1122
15th Sep 2009, 23:54
Who came up with Legend. They were headed in the right direction for a modern TR..... then Toby and eric were hired....... and Underworld was their gift to us... kind of a disappointing sequel..

Underworld is what the ''hardcore'' fan base were whining about since Legend first came out and when they got it, they still complained(not surprised). It's the basic pattern of fans really. Cry till you get what you want or something of similar interest and then when you do get what I just mentioned, they still cry some more, it's a never ending cycle

Go to modern type of game play with more shooting and action(Legend), hardcore fan base lets you have it. Try to somewhat bring a feel of older TRs with Underworld, non-hardcore fan base cries.

*Yes I know countless Anti-TRU are going to be like ''Pfft! TRU was nowhere near CORE's TRs'' or whatever,go ahead you'll be talking to a wall lol*

Basically CD will have to give one of the fan bases a shove out the door and it will be the ''hardcore'' fan base, guaranteed. We fans of Tomb Raider and what we consider a Tomb Raider game are in the minority. It wont be long before CD/EIDOS ditch the long time fans for the bigger piece of the pie which is the 3PS genre. While it will anger me, its business and its going to happen soon,rather than later.

It's best to enjoy the games we currently have(TR1 to Underworld) because we will not be seeing games anywhere near their calibur and likeness probably not anytime in the near future because the TR stand point will change drastically to appeal to the bigger market and sadly that does not include us

Natla
16th Sep 2009, 06:50
A non-"classic" Tomb Raider game might be alright. I think people were more bothered about the changes to the biography of Her Ladyship than anything else. If they stop messing with that - it is largely irreleveant to the gameplay IMO - I'm sure the game will be well received. The versions of Lara in the games always were broadly drawn caricatures and not mean to be strictly "realistic".

I have no opinion about Toby Gard leaving as I'm not entirely sure what his role was.

jayjay119
16th Sep 2009, 13:02
A non-"classic" Tomb Raider game might be alright. I think people were more bothered about the changes to the biography of Her Ladyship than anything else. If they stop messing with that - it is largely irreleveant to the gameplay IMO - I'm sure the game will be well received. The versions of Lara in the games always were broadly drawn caricatures and not mean to be strictly "realistic".

I have no opinion about Toby Gard leaving as I'm not entirely sure what his role was.

The change in backstory was certainly one of the most annoying parts of Legend 'Revitalization' of the series, which for some strange reason was Toby's idea... I really do not get why, six games into a series a person would change their own character's backstory... was this his was of making Lara more his creation again? Whatever the reason it wasn't that hard to swallow if ou just imagine that CD's TR games are set in a parallel universe to core's ones which most fans have taken as truth.

The more combat heavy focus was not even that really big a problem for me, the main problem was that it was mediocre combat it was just run into a room shoot and continue until end of level with a bit of plaforming spliced in, and of what platforming there was it wasn't really that entertaining considering what had been done previously. It was generic, linear, boring and not identifiable as TR, if you stuck the name Tomb Raider on the game WET then you would just have Legends spiritual (in terms of gameplay) sequel!

What fans who were gained with Legend don't realize it that TR has always been about platforming, not combat which is all they seem to want it to be.. ' make it more like uncharted' well no make it individual like it always has been, there are enough generic shooters for you to play out there and are likely to be hundreds more in the next year or two till the market changes again, if you want a game like uncharted, go and buy uncharted.

Things need to be better balanced with more of a refocused vision on the platforming and puzzles but with decent and entertaining combat also. Again keep what is important to the franchise whilst updating accordingly.

tombraidergal
16th Sep 2009, 17:31
Couldnt care less. (no offence)

josh1122
16th Sep 2009, 18:26
Toby Gard, co-creator of Tomb Raider who left Crystal Dynamics earlier this month to become a consultant, gave an interview to GamesIndustry.Biz in which he said game development's going all Hollywood, and that's where he fits in.

Right now, Gard (pictured above) says, the m.o. is to fire a bunch of people at the end of a project, but keep around a core team for future work on the IP. "[A]nd it's not really working out the way it should be," Gard said.


''It seems like the industry wants to move to a more Hollywood model by bringing in experts for shorter periods of time and then leveraging their outsourcing, but also building small teams for projects.

But they haven't actually fully embraced that yet and I'm just wondering whether or not there's a way people will actually start doing that. The industry is still very stuck in its ways of building their internal teams.''


Gard's consulting business - ding ding ding - could exploit that short-term need for experts, which is one reason he left Crystal Dynamics. Another, according to his remarks, is that he'd taken Tomb Raider about as far as he could, and he wasn't working much with Lara Croft anymore.

''It's always difficult doing that but you can get stuck doing the same thing over and over, The only real way that I can really effect Lara Croft is to be in charge of a project. More and more as I was working at Crystal, especially on Underworld where I was just doing cinematic work, the reality is the control of the characters is in the hands of the creative directors and the publisher.''

http://kotaku.com/5360292/tomb-raider-co+creator-games-moving-toward-hollywood-business-model

jayjay119
16th Sep 2009, 18:41
As i expected, he left because he didn't get his own way... again. That's from reading between the lines of course. As for games studios doing things more like hollywood with smaller teams, its the first we've heard of it from and only from one development team so I dunno if there is truth in what he is saying but smaller teams usually do better work anyway!

JRod108
16th Sep 2009, 21:38
Sure, he created Lara and all, but he doesn't seem, to me anyway, that he is a critical part of TR. Almost everything I've read about a TR game in development has been like this: "Oh, well, I heard Toby was going to finally be in charge, so it should be great." Or, "Is Toby in charge? If he isn't then this game is going to be an epic fail!"

Now, those aren't direct quotes, but it seems that it's always "Toby Gard" this, and "Toby Gard that." I really don't understand the hype about him. I really don't have any opinion to the guy, but will someone who loves him please tell me what exactly is so special about him that gets all this worship? Besides creating Lara...

josh1122
17th Sep 2009, 00:02
I think he kinda kept developers in line a little bit with his imput on her character. Now with him gone, even though hes no longer a main vocal point(according to him) of the development. We're going to see drastic changes to Lara. Well anyone can all ready see it with TR jumping into the horror genre

DarthVader#1
17th Sep 2009, 02:42
awwwww... i'll miss you Toby! :(

nikkinickels
17th Sep 2009, 10:59
I think he kinda kept developers in line a little bit with his imput on her character. Now with him gone, even though hes no longer a main vocal point(according to him) of the development. We're going to see drastic changes to Lara. Well anyone can all ready see it with TR jumping into the horror genre


now i see why X_X oh boy, but CD better watch it or at least look through these forums and know we don't want her to change too much :[ the horror thing doesn't bother me at all, it's just i hope they don't change her biography...again. and change her face too much, besides having to be younger lol i understand how toby feels though, i wouldn't want my craation to drastically change for someone else. he's an overprotective father :P

jayjay119
17th Sep 2009, 17:01
now i see why X_X oh boy, but CD better watch it or at least look through these forums and know we don't want her to change too much :[ the horror thing doesn't bother me at all, it's just i hope they don't change her biography...again. and change her face too much, besides having to be younger lol i understand how toby feels though, i wouldn't want my craation to drastically change for someone else. he's an overprotective father :P

I don't think he can exactly talk considering he had a big hand in creating 'wimpy Lara' from Legend. Its one thing when someone else changes your character without you but to do it yourself!

josh1122
17th Sep 2009, 21:47
I don't think he can exactly talk considering he had a big hand in creating 'wimpy Lara' from Legend. Its one thing when someone else changes your character without you but to do it yourself!

Either way the beginning of the end for Lara starts here, Tomb Raider 9. I'm not really sure how people can deny that. Going from stuff like Legend/Anniversary/Underworld to the horror survival genre? I fail to see how people are thinking it makes sense.

The only thing kinda comparable would be Legend Lara and her switch to a 3PS type of style game play over raiding. But this trumps even that

Pulse
18th Sep 2009, 03:54
Stop being so negative! They are doing what they think will save the series. i think moving into the Mature space with more action and thrills is a great idea.

And an open world seems like exploration will play a huge role! I like what i'm seeing.

And 'wimpy' Lara from Legend was bad ass. She killed people with sarcastic comments. She had emotions for the first time and some people hate that. i'd like to see more emotions in TR9. I've never seen Lara laugh. I want to!!!

josh1122
18th Sep 2009, 04:24
Stop being so negative! They are doing what they think will save the series. i think moving into the Mature space with more action and thrills is a great idea.

And an open world seems like exploration will play a huge role! I like what i'm seeing.

And 'wimpy' Lara from Legend was bad ass. She killed people with sarcastic comments. She had emotions for the first time and some people hate that. i'd like to see more emotions in TR9. I've never seen Lara laugh. I want to!!!

I agree about the M rating, I don't think a lot of people even care if its M rated, no one really minds and embraces it. M rating definitely opens up various opportunities that maybe past games didnt see or have, we'll have to see.

I also agree with you on exploration, if done right, could be a great thing,BUT, as stated before until CD proves it can do open world, I remain skeptical. Here's to hoping though

Also yes it seems fans hate Lara to show emotion, this is more so the CORE related fans,while I'm a fan for the CORE era as I like to call it. I have no problem with Lara showing emotions. Most fans just got used to the machine like robotic Lara from the past games and really never coped with Lara actually seeming human. I could be wrong but thats my interpretation on it.

Dusk Knight
18th Sep 2009, 05:00
Regarding Toby Gard and the backstory, this is what he had to say in the AoD companion:

My initial back-story for Lara Croft was extremely sketchy. She's British, the whole plane crash and living in a mansion and that was as far as it pretty much went. I didn't get into enormous reams of back-story.
It seems that the aspects that were later changed by Crystal were written by TR1 script writer Vicky Arnold and Core PR manager Suzie Hamilton. Gard may have supervised and had input, but the parts that were changed weren't really his, so I suppose he didn't mind. Of course, he had nothing to do with the later Von Croy additions, so there's no reason he would have wanted to keep that. I think his main story focus was the Atlantean mythos of TR1, and that's why Crystal revisited it several times.

I know Toby contributed to the revised backstory in Legend, but I hadn't heard that it was his idea to begin with. It sounds like he was mainly an influence at Crystal, never really in control of the direction.


I can't really say more about Toby's vision of Lara except to say that with all the hundreds of ideas we tossed around, on the spectrum of "That's too hardcore for Lara to do..." Toby was on the far end of the spectrum. He does think of her as a well-behaved psychopath, and well, so do I.
That quote is what had me thinking that the leaked concept was his idea. And who knows? Maybe it was his idea and he left because they aren't using it, or they weren't giving him much control over how it's used.

jayjay119
18th Sep 2009, 15:26
Either way the beginning of the end for Lara starts here, Tomb Raider 9. I'm not really sure how people can deny that. Going from stuff like Legend/Anniversary/Underworld to the horror survival genre? I fail to see how people are thinking it makes sense.

The only thing kinda comparable would be Legend Lara and her switch to a 3PS type of style game play over raiding. But this trumps even that

Personally I disagree, I'm not really sure how people are jumping to the hypothesis that TR9 will be survival horror just from a few screens, plus even if it did it would still be popular in Europe and Japan which is TR's main audience anyway, it's the American fans or lack thereof that is the problem. I'd prefer Tomb Raider with a slight survival horror theme than 'Tomb Shooter' any day.


i'd like to see more emotions in TR9. I've never seen Lara laugh. I want to!!!
Watch this till the end
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QaZgZrZjiA
Hope you like it:wave: This is the most human i've ever seen Lara, she's so cute!

josh1122
18th Sep 2009, 20:21
Personally I disagree, I'm not really sure how people are jumping to the hypothesis that TR9 will be survival horror just from a few screens, plus even if it did it would still be popular in Europe and Japan which is TR's main audience anyway, it's the American fans or lack thereof that is the problem. I'd prefer Tomb Raider with a slight survival horror theme than 'Tomb Shooter' any day.


Watch this till the end
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QaZgZrZjiA
Hope you like it:wave: This is the most human i've ever seen Lara, she's so cute!

I find your ''its the americans that are causing the problem'' very ignorant. Funny, how its always someone from the UK to attack an american on these boards. Souns like you have un-needed hostility towards americans just because they differ with your opinion.

Also I agree it would be popular but it wouldn't be a Tomb Raider game. So I take it your not a fan of Tomb Raider since you embrace the entire genre catering to whats ''popular''.

Again I find your comments very ignorant. If that wasn't your intetion to bash a certain group then I apologize but its what it seemed like you were doing

Pulse
18th Sep 2009, 20:27
+1 on Josh's comment.

That laugh was slightly disturbing... :confused:

I'd like to see a more natural laugh from Keeley hawes

Ants_27_
18th Sep 2009, 21:13
+1 on Josh's comment.

That laugh was slightly disturbing... :confused:

I'd like to see a more natural laugh from Keeley hawes

Try this then
Skip to 2:44 - 3:29
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92C9wOa0BTc&feature=channel_page :cool:

It's not really Lara, but Keeley all the same:P:cool:

Now I think people would moan if they added lines into the next TR like this one:
Either watch Keeley get angry or just skip to 0:51 ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7JqJ6AORJo&feature=channel I'm sorry, couldn't resist.

Max 28
19th Sep 2009, 09:45
Watch this till the end
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QaZgZrZjiA
Hope you like it:wave: This is the most human i've ever seen Lara, she's so cute!

Haha, that was fun, The animation let it down at points but cool none the less. I wish she said a bit more than all the strikes and curses though.

Rexie
19th Sep 2009, 10:42
Haha, that was fun, The animation let it down at points but cool none the less. I wish she said a bit more than all the strikes and curses though.

Here's what the bloopers are from:

ppP3Bl44sL8

Arctic
19th Sep 2009, 13:49
Oh, that's kinda sad.. Oh well.

nikkinickels
19th Sep 2009, 15:09
hahah i laugh at how she said the curses, but yeah i wish the bloopers were longer, it was too funny :]

tombraidergal
19th Sep 2009, 16:42
the bum waggle was just so slutty.... pardon my french. but absolutely hilarious!

jayjay119
19th Sep 2009, 20:19
I find your ''its the americans that are causing the problem'' very ignorant. Funny, how its always someone from the UK to attack an american on these boards. Souns like you have un-needed hostility towards americans just because they differ with your opinion.

Also I agree it would be popular but it wouldn't be a Tomb Raider game. So I take it your not a fan of Tomb Raider since you embrace the entire genre catering to whats ''popular''.

Again I find your comments very ignorant. If that wasn't your intetion to bash a certain group then I apologize but its what it seemed like you were doing

Let me just make one thing crystal clear, I have no prejudice against America at all, against anyone in fact so please don't accuse me of such things Josh if that's how it came across then i'm sorry.

However I was just stating what I felt in a way with this whole genre jumping none sense. There was a statement a while back from Eidos before the takeover from SE that though Europe and Japan were still strong fans, after the 'poor sales' of TRU in the American market they would be revamping the whole series to make it more popular there (remember the whole 'female friendly Lara article? that same one), so clearly that market was perceived as a big problem, no prejudice at all just going from past info.

I don't know what you mean by that I am not fan or TR as I don't mind the series converting to what is popular in the market, how many times have I said that is not what I want? I do not want TR to become a shooter (I actually got the opposite message from your post, yet I know you don't want that) nor do i want it to become a survival horror, anything I said was hypothetical as I don't believe the series to be changing genre at all but if it did then I would rather go to survival horror than a shooter.

tombraidergal
19th Sep 2009, 20:27
nicely said Jayjay119, nicely said...

Lancestombraidersite
8th May 2010, 18:36
WOW, he quite again! why is he doing this? he is being successful? now he is acting baby-ish. i wonder what happened?