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AdobeArtist
6th Sep 2009, 22:55
I just got to finishing Batman Arkham Asylum (with all 240 Riddler challenges solved as well... yes, I am taking this minute to brag :p:cool: ) and to say I was amazed by this game would be a vast understatement. This is a milestone in game design, from the implementation of the Unreal engine in a unique art direction, to the level design, to the audio, to the story, to the impeccable gameplay mechanics seamlessly blending fluid combat with predatory stealth with an array of hi tech gadgets with intelligent puzzle solving. And of course a responsive control scheme that made play very smooth.

I *bleeping* LOVE this game. Now I also enjoyed what Crystal Dynamics did with Tomb Raider. They helped revive the franchise when it went into decline after TR3, they weaved an inticate story of mythologies, they advanced Lara's capabilities in Underworld (dual targeting, shooting while hanging, adrenaline headshots, etc...). Some people complain about CDs work, but I think in the long run they saved the series from fading into oblivion.

But then I experienced what Rocksteady did with Batman and was completely blown away. The experience pulled me in so much and I ended up playing 5-6 hour marathons at a stretch, while I aquired the next ability, got to the next unreachable area, discovered the next plot twist, located the next trophy... and on and on. They weaved a game of such intricate craftsmanship loaded with variety to keep things fresh at every turn.

If any of you have played this game you will know what I'm talking about. They showed they can produce a game that gets the notice of players and critics alike. It's already heralded as quite possibly the greatest super hero game of all time.

So naturally with Rocksteady working with Eidos/Square, this got me to wondering what TR could be like under their expert care, what new heights of potential could be reached for the franchise. As much as I respect and appreciate Crystal Dynamics (a feeling I know some here don't share) maybe Rocksteady can give the series the boost it really needs.

What do you think?

Bampire
6th Sep 2009, 23:51
I honestly don't care who makes it, as long as it's done right.

pinpal
7th Sep 2009, 00:08
Really I don't care but crystal seems to be doing a pretty good job to me.:)

AdobeArtist
7th Sep 2009, 00:21
I actually agree, CD has done a good job, never said they did a bad job. Rocksteady on the other hand has done an outstanding job, earning recognition and acclaim.

But I'll also admit, I'm not dead set on abandoning CD, just pondering possibilities. Back in the day when Tomb Raider was introduced to the scene, it was loved by everyone. But over time, as mistakes were made by the developers, the series lost favor with journalist and gamers, to the point where just a select few kept playing the games. People like us who stayed devoted out of a sense of sentiment we formed for some reason or another.

It became niche, where outside our fandom, has become regarded as a fad from the past that didn't stand the test of time, even becoming target of rididcule. And I would love to see the series reclaim is former glory, when it was prestigious and celebrated by gaming publications and the majority of gamers, where Lara gains the affection of anybody into games and not just a clique group, just like back when she first graced the stage and inspired awe in so many of us.

Andy64
7th Sep 2009, 00:28
I would be very happy to see crystal do the next TR game. I think they will and should. However out of loyalty and respect for the company that made it all happen my vote goes to Core. Would love to see them reformed and doing TR again. It's not an anti-CD thing as I said CD doing the next game is very cool too.

Max 28
7th Sep 2009, 05:34
I haven't yet played Arkham Asylum so I'll save my vote for now. But from what I have heard and seen it does look as if Rocksteady have gone all out and produced an absolutely amazing game. I'm very supportive of CD, and would feel a bit sad and disloyal to see them go but it's true that TR has fallen from it's glory. Not at CD's hands at Cores it fell and CD did very well re-vamping TR IMO, but the thought of TR returning to an elite game and continuing to become even better than it has ever been is deffinately tempting.

But I think before jumping the bandwagon just yet it'd be better to see where CD goes next. Hearing the news of a supposed re-vamp is also very exciting and maybe will accomplish what we would want from Rocksteady anyway. But if CD doesn't deliver on the next two games, or the next one is a complete embarresment I would be behing Rocksteady.

So I think I'll vote CD, cause I wanna wait for the next game. :)

IvanaKC
7th Sep 2009, 05:36
Let's stay with Crystal.
They are. in my opinion, doing great job for now.

Tihocan
7th Sep 2009, 05:50
I'd stick with CD, if only just for the prior experience and (hopefully) new larger development capacity (in the way of budget, at least).
If they screw the next one up, it's safe to say that the fault is not on deadlines and budget, but creative capacity. Then I'll jump ship.

oraclebop
7th Sep 2009, 06:25
I think CD can do it, just give them time to actually make something good.

They need to work on a:

-A Good Story
-Implement what they have in various ways and to it's fullest extent (Free Climbing, Grapple)
-Listen to the fans

:)

josh1122
7th Sep 2009, 07:01
hell no, i mean nah, no way

also i disagre with whoever said, 'listen to the fans' F that lol

fans have no clue what they even want so thats pointless

Max 28
7th Sep 2009, 07:29
^^^ New you'd say the fans thing.

oraclebop
7th Sep 2009, 08:39
Then don't listen to the fans then.

We fans know **** about Tomb Raider because we have played it since possibly Core's days and know what Tomb Raider is about.

Anger aside, CD, take a risk. If you're gonna do something, give it your best and give something new a shot. You're not gonna learn until you try. ;)

Jurre
7th Sep 2009, 09:16
I believe there is no such thing as 'fans'. There is one fan and then another, and then a million more, and they all got different ideas on how it should be.
I believe the frase: 'they don't listen to the fans' actally means they're not listening to the person in question.

Considering Rocksteady: I think they did a good job in making a game of a popular longtime franchise... - even though I've heard sounds from the hardcore Batman fanbase who speak of 'missed chances' *sigh* - but I think Crystal D could do a good job as well when given the proper time and resources. You must know that Rocksteady Studios is an independent studio, not property of Eidos like Crystal D.... I don't wanna jump to any conclusions but I wonder what would have happened to Underworld if Crystal D was an independent studio as well.

qwerty
7th Sep 2009, 09:59
the batman game was meh...mediocre....tru was terrible thats for sure...but provided that they are doing their best for their next 3A game(which i think will be a new tr),and taking into account the SqE take over i think that the next tr will be a marvelous game..the only franchises of eidos that were worth that take over are:tr,hitman(so to speak),tr,a ponies based franchise(?!?!),tr,just cause,tr,loK, and yes tr again....i for once im prepared to say lara i love u....

oraclebop
7th Sep 2009, 10:57
Just a question, but how is it mediocre? :eek:

josh1122
7th Sep 2009, 11:29
Then don't listen to the fans then.

We fans know **** about Tomb Raider because we have played it since possibly Core's days and know what Tomb Raider is about.

Anger aside, CD, take a risk. If you're gonna do something, give it your best and give something new a shot. You're not gonna learn until you try. ;)

your right they(we) don't KNOW :whistle:, I agree lol

Cry if they(CD) dont,Cry if they(CD) do.

Pulse
7th Sep 2009, 12:01
Who voted for Core? It'd be pretty impossible to get them to do it right?

Besides Toby is with CD.

Fans opinions differ too greatly. Listening to the fans would result in a big mess. Or a lot of backlash because they took opinions that only half of the fans wanted... so let CD do their thing and stop whining. Hmm, Kay?

Jurre
7th Sep 2009, 12:07
so let CD do their thing and stop whining. Hmm, Kay?Absolutely, that should've been done from the beginning.

Gr8guy
7th Sep 2009, 14:28
Not a chance in hell, cd is doing ok in my opinion, im just very upset about lara not saving her mother though, that spoiled it. The only reason I really wanted to play was to save her actually

JRod108
7th Sep 2009, 17:06
I have absolutely no opinion on Rocksteady as I have not played any game they have developed so I voted for CD to stay.

CD has a ton of potential, they just have know idea how to harness it. It seems as if they're just stuck in their little comfort zone and either they have no desire to move out of it, or they are too scared to.

I know CD will probably never become one of my favorite devs like Bioware, Bungie, and Ubisoft are but I still have hope in them.

LARALOVERnr1
7th Sep 2009, 17:19
One word; NO!
stay with CD sounds goo to me.

jayjay119
7th Sep 2009, 18:18
To be honest, I have never heard of Rocksteady before entering this thread, the only time I am familiar with the name actually is as the band No Doubts 2002 album. However just because they get one franchise does not mean that they will get every franchise. CD is not doing a bad job with TR, quite the opposite in fact. Yes they have had a few hiccoughs here and there but who hasn't. The truth is a sa developer CD are doing great, they listen to the fans and always seem to balance as best they can. The biggest problem with CD's games is that they have always been under some restrains or remit, now that they will hopefully be able to develop in peace at their own pace and their own ideas rather than being forced to learn, forced to do remakes or forced to do release games early I really look forward to see what they bring to the table, and if some of the recent 'leaked material' is any example the next game will be great.

Therefore I vote for staying with CD.

BlackThor
7th Sep 2009, 22:00
i think they could do a joint project with cd. so rocksteady could add some kick ass new features and gameplay, but cd would be there to make sure the product is still recognizably tomb raider(i.e great story with exceptionally well integrated mythology)

NightRain'06
8th Sep 2009, 06:00
The irony was, if anyone else saw the end credits to BAA as well, you would have seen a very short list of Crystal Dynamics team somehow being involved with it which had approximately 4(?) people. If I recall, I don't think it was exactly from within the development team because the titles seemed to be from different departments. In any case, my reaction was :eek: as in good surprise.

In answer to this thread, though, personally I voted no.

I think Rocksteady should stay with Batman and CD should stay with TR.

seashell093
8th Sep 2009, 13:29
core with a next gen engine :D

jayjay119
8th Sep 2009, 16:31
The irony was, if anyone else saw the end credits to BAA as well, you would have seen a very short list of Crystal Dynamics team somehow being involved with it which had approximately 4(?) people.

Isn't that all that was left of CD after the recent dismissals:rasp:

josh1122
9th Sep 2009, 20:50
Isn't that all that was left of CD after the recent dismissals:rasp:

http://instantrimshot.com/

:lol:

Error96_
12th Sep 2009, 00:42
I think Crystal are going to do a better job on the next TR. They are doing well (even though TRU wasn't my fav TR) and I think they are going to evolve Lara through going back to her roots.

In one way though I would just be real intrested to see what would happen if Core got back together and made another TR. Anything could happen with that which would be exciting.

josh1122
12th Sep 2009, 04:43
In one way though I would just be real intrested to see what would happen if Core got back together and made another TR. Anything could happen with that which would be exciting.

I'd cry if CORE got back together, their last few games were some of the most god awful things to hit the gaming market :mad2:

so thankfully they're dead and buried now. They should've quit when they were ahead(like they originally intended). But were forced to put out Chronicles and AOD -_-

Flintmelody
12th Sep 2009, 11:34
I'd cry if CORE got back together, their last few games were some of the most god awful things to hit the gaming market :mad2:

so thankfully they're dead and buried now. They should've quit when they were ahead(like they originally intended). But were forced to put out Chronicles and AOD -_-

Probably the most cruel, nasty and unfair comments I have read thus far in my time on this forum. Core got Lara to the top and made her a household name and to say your happy that they are finnished. It just not at all a nice thing to say at all.

jayjay119
12th Sep 2009, 18:35
Probably the most cruel, nasty and unfair comments I have read thus far in my time on this forum. Core got Lara to the top and made her a household name and to say your happy that they are finnished. It just not at all a nice thing to say at all.

Nice or not its still true, Core may have gotten TR to the top but it also got it to its lowest point it had ever been and that's a fact. Personally i think Core weren't all to blame for AOD and I liked Chronicles, but that's not for here.

Error96_
12th Sep 2009, 23:54
I don't want to draw the thread into a Core vs CD debate but I feel I MUST in this case defend Core. The dead and buried remark was a horrid thing to say. Core and Eidos got TR all the way to the top and made TR in to one of the biggest series out there. They pushed the boundaries of gaming creating pioneering revolutionary games and making Lara croft a name everyone knows.

Around chronicles Core's TR games wern't at the best falling behind rival series and the reinvention in AOD was brilliant in parts but very flawed. Certainly not the worst games out there at the time though. Maybe not ending at the best but in the early days Core did an outstanding and incredible job to make TR big. CD have built on the TR series but it was Core what originally made it. I think Josh's 'ha, ha Core's dead' type of comment is very immature for a TR fan. Try going back and playing TR 1-3 and see Core's best work then maybe you will change your mind.

Sorry for the rant everyone.

Gemma_Darkmoon_
13th Sep 2009, 00:15
Don't go starting a Core and Crystal debate again. Plenty of threads already for it. Everyone knows that saying strong negative things about either Core or CD is going to trigger this so just don't go doing that.

josh1122
13th Sep 2009, 03:09
I don't want to draw the thread into a Core vs CD debate but I feel I MUST in this case defend Core. The dead and buried remark was a horrid thing to say. Core and Eidos got TR all the way to the top and made TR in to one of the biggest series out there. They pushed the boundaries of gaming creating pioneering revolutionary games and making Lara croft a name everyone knows.

Around chronicles Core's TR games wern't at the best falling behind rival series and the reinvention in AOD was brilliant in parts but very flawed. Certainly not the worst games out there at the time though. Maybe not ending at the best but in the early days Core did an outstanding and incredible job to make TR big. CD have built on the TR series but it was Core what originally made it. I think Josh's 'ha, ha Core's dead' type of comment is very immature for a TR fan. Try going back and playing TR 1-3 and see Core's best work then maybe you will change your mind.

Sorry for the rant everyone.

I've been with TR since the beginning and im sorry if you please go back and read you would note i single out AOD and Chronicles only:lol:

Also CORE brought TR to the top, we all agree on that but nearly killed it too :rasp:

But I'm with Gemma, CORE vs CD debates are for another place,date and time. Take to PM(with me) or we'll find a similar thread for it. Which they're pointless debates as well

Pulse
13th Sep 2009, 04:31
May I please throw in my 2 cents about core as well??

Anyway, CORE are the ones who ruined TR in the first place

IT doesn't matter if the first 3 games were good, CD has 3 good games after all, CORE is still dead. CD are doing their best and they're the ones who saved Tomb Raider so fans should show them respect.

Besides the lara from CORE was over sexed and an ugly stereotype of what is supposedly attractive and I hate her :mad2::mad2::mad2:

off to start a smaller breast petition, bye :wave:

josh1122
13th Sep 2009, 05:46
May I please throw in my 2 cents about core as well??

Anyway, CORE are the ones who ruined TR in the first place

IT doesn't matter if the first 3 games were good, CD has 3 good games after all, CORE is still dead. CD are doing their best and they're the ones who saved Tomb Raider so fans should show them respect.

Besides the lara from CORE was over sexed and an ugly stereotype of what is supposedly attractive and I hate her :mad2::mad2::mad2:

off to start a smaller breast petition, bye :wave:

Both have their good and bad qualities, thats pretty much how the argument should start and end with and if you think CORE over-sexed Lara, then apparently you have never seen Soul Calibur or similar games. They make your ''sexed up lara'' look like a Nun

Flintmelody
13th Sep 2009, 13:17
May I please throw in my 2 cents about core as well??

Anyway, CORE are the ones who ruined TR in the first place

IT doesn't matter if the first 3 games were good, CD has 3 good games after all, CORE is still dead. CD are doing their best and they're the ones who saved Tomb Raider so fans should show them respect.

Besides the lara from CORE was over sexed and an ugly stereotype of what is supposedly attractive and I hate her :mad2::mad2::mad2:

off to start a smaller breast petition, bye :wave:

To me it does matter what happened in the first 3 Core TR's. That was when TR was biggest and when it became a massive series. That makes it was the most important bit of TR history. I am glad CD revived TR and think outside of TRU they have done a fantastic job. CD get respect from me but Core, Eidos and Nathan get masses of respect too. They deserve it for all their great work whatever happened at the end.

I liked the Core Lara look and personality. The image of Core's Lara became so iconic and is a look that made TR so bad. Lara's looks and body shape are part of her appeal if that is good or bad. If anything the Japan dress was the outfit to draw attention to Lara's curves the most. That dosn't have to be a bad thing.

chriss_99
13th Sep 2009, 13:43
hell no, i mean nah, no way

also i disagre with whoever said, 'listen to the fans' F that lol

fans have no clue what they even want so thats pointless

I do agree with that statement. It's sad but true.
I changed my opinion on that one after Underworld and a massive disappointment among the majority of fans.

_Love2Raid_
13th Sep 2009, 13:53
Crystal Dynamics are on the right track if you ask me, Underworld was a great game. Besides, they are already far in development so what does it matter?

Andy64
13th Sep 2009, 16:32
I think CD have done a great job with Legend and Anniversary. Thought TRU was a real mess though. A boring game with little replayability but I think the concept's for the next one look better. Will see how this one goes.

Pulse
14th Sep 2009, 00:25
I didn't say other ladies in gaming weren't oversexed. They are, 99.4 % of the time. So shouldn't Lara be more than a "big boobed british chick in short-shorts"

josh1122
14th Sep 2009, 07:01
I didn't say other ladies in gaming weren't oversexed. They are, 99.4 % of the time. So shouldn't Lara be more than a "big boobed british chick in short-shorts"

your new to the series right?

BobbyDQ
17th Sep 2009, 16:37
Core had best ideas and Crystal had the best actual game mechanics. Would be brilliant if the two could be combined.

Sandra Croft
17th Sep 2009, 19:43
I voted stay with CD because I liked the leaked artwork, I love the sound of an open world TR and a mature one, however if they screw up this one too then I say had it over to Rocksteady.