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KSingh77
23rd Aug 2009, 19:32
If you can't find a health kit anywhere,food can be a great alternative.If the Deus Ex 1 and 2 has them why not this game?Eat up a nutrient bar or drink some soda to replenish your health.It can fill up some of your health back if you don't have med kits.


But one thing that bothers me is the auto health regen unless you have an option to turn it off.

I think food should be an alternative towards refilling your health.

Hell at least let us hack a vending machine,thats what the brain hacking RTS style thing is for right?

Hertzila
23rd Aug 2009, 19:54
Though unlike in DX3, Adam most likely doesn't have huge amunts of hp which the food heals by minicule amounts. Also the in-game explanation was that the nanites "eat" the food directly and those little things are also pretty much non-existant in DX.

jd10013
23rd Aug 2009, 20:04
Have we got an official answer on med kits yet? I still think the auto heal, if done right could work. but, It will definitely be quite a balancing act. On the one hand, I can understand why the devs don't want players having to constantly reload, or waste time needlessly searching for a medkit. On the other hand, doing it wrong will make the game too easy, and kill the fun. If they create a situation where you can just carelessly run into every area knowing that you health will just regenerate then the fun will be lost after about 15 minutes. There has to be a consequence for taking fire, damage and death. and you have to have the player worried about dying. It can also ruin the use of fire, explosives, and even water. you wouldn't have to worry about self inflicted damage, or drowning damage cause heck, just wait a little bit and your good as new.

Personally, I loved food in various games. I loved how in DX I would sometimes grab every can of soda in the machine just to get enough heath so that I felt comfortable going into the next room where I know a couple NSF guys were. I also loved sneaking around rooms hugging the wall crouched down because I knew my health was low and I couldn't risk an unnecessary encounter.

Auto health, if done wrong, has the potential to just make it run and gun shooter.

Daedalus.
24th Aug 2009, 04:18
You need to add pizza to the game; so, we can eat it, and ... of course, ice cream. Remember the ice cream vending machines that we used to have in the '80s. I remember going to the LA Zoo, and being able to get an ice cream sandwich from a vending machine.


.

minus0ne
24th Aug 2009, 05:28
Any suggestions for "doing it right"?

Unless you're a terribad with koala reflexes and dual analog sticks, every form of health regeneration I can imagine can be easily abused and makes the game easy mode LONG before 15 minutes.
I'd tolerate health-regen if it was done right, which is my view would be an extremely slow regeneration rate (think KOTOR early on in the game, but at least five times slower).

It'd also have to be properly explained to ease suspension of disbelief (like the healing nano-aug): for example, there could be a mechanical augmentation which releases tiny capsules into the bloodstream, which burst by directing ultrasound at the wounded tissue, similar to the Philips SonoDrugs (http://www.sonodrugs.eu/) project. These capsules could carry anything from medical glue to stop bleeding to disinfectants or antibiotics, and substances which facilitate healing (hey, it's the future, right?).

In other words, you'd still need to supplement auto-healing by other means, like DX3's equivalent of medkits, bots and food/drink.

TrickyVein
24th Aug 2009, 11:55
^^ but that still sounds like nanotech - small enough to float around in the blood stream, through all of those capillaries? This raises an interesting point - how can mechanical augmentation account for regenerating health? Oh, and food is a must. I always carried around a few forty's in my inventory to relax and wind down after an assassination or fire fight. Good fun.

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 13:09
The interesting thing about regen is how the first game approached it- pre-Hong Kong, you were forced to use a medpack system. Once you hit Versalife though, you've got access to a regenerating health system. If you choose regenerating health (and it's vastly more attractive than the alternative aug for that slot, so I don't know anybody who didn't choose it) then medpacks became a secondary, and no longer necessary element of resource management. The result was that halfway through the game, to match the increasing difficulty level of the enemies, the game effectively switched health mechanics- and the player stopped carrying medpacks and other food because they were no longer necessary. I'm just realizing this now, but in DX1, after Versalife (and the regen aug canister), you don't encounter anybody asking for food, like the kids in Battery Park, probably because the likelyhood of you already carrying a candybar at that point is drastically reduced. Huh. Now that I think about it, the regen aug didn't get rid of medpacks- it merely renamed them. Once you could convert BE into health, the BE Cell turned into the medpack. A regenerating health system, that's something close to Call of Duty 4 when you're in combat, and that still involves resource management. So it is possible to pull off in DX3- the first game proved as much.

----
It'll take some real imagination to figure out the technobabble on how DX3's regeneration system works, I can agree with that.
----

Now, more on the OP's topic at hand:
In DX3, I personally think that food will play a largely aesthetic role- pretty much there as window dressing, but with some usefulness as a tool for talking with NPCs (a la the kids in Battery Park) and some minor influence on player stealth- you could throw food and stuff to draw enemies away.

jd10013
24th Aug 2009, 13:12
Any suggestions for "doing it right"?

Unless you're a terribad with koala reflexes and dual analog sticks, every form of health regeneration I can imagine can be easily abused and makes the game easy mode LONG before 15 minutes.

the model used in FEAR would be ok with me. your health regenerates, and kind of fast. but only a minimal amount, 25 points I believe. that way keeps you from constantly having to reload, and can get you through a tight situtation. but it's not enough to keep you from searching around and using med kits. especially once you've increased your HP up.


The interesting thing about regen is how the first game approached it- pre-Hong Kong, you were forced to use a medpack system. Once you hit Versalife though, you've got access to a regenerating health system. If you choose regenerating health (and it's vastly more attractive than the alternative aug for that slot, so I don't know anybody who didn't choose it) then medpacks became a secondary, and no longer necessary element of resource management. The result was that halfway through the game, to match the increasing difficulty level of the enemies, the game effectively switched health mechanics- and the player stopped carrying medpacks and other food because they were no longer necessary. I'm just realizing this now, but in DX1, after Versalife (and the regen aug canister), you don't encounter anybody asking for food, like the kids in Battery Park, probably because the likelyhood of you already carrying a candybar at that point is drastically reduced. Huh. Now that I think about it, the regen aug didn't get rid of medpacks- it merely renamed them. Once you could convert BE into health, the BE Cell turned into the medpack. A regenerating health system, that's something close to Call of Duty 4 when you're in combat, and that still involves resource management. So it is possible to pull off in DX3- the first game proved as much.

that's why I think if done right it can work. I just don't want something like in crysis where you just hide behind a bush for 10 seconds and good as new.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
24th Aug 2009, 13:19
If you can't find a health kit anywhere,food can be a great alternative.If the Deus Ex 1 and 2 has them why not this game?Eat up a nutrient bar or drink some soda to replenish your health.It can fill up some of your health back if you don't have med kits.?

I'm sure it will be nutrient bars of vegetarian source. ;)

*awaits backlash* :p

spm1138
24th Aug 2009, 14:41
tbh I found it a little immersion breaking that I could eat a chocolate bar to heal gunshot wounds :D

I know it made sense in the context of the story and they wrote it in with nanites but still.

Ashpolt
24th Aug 2009, 15:04
The interesting thing about regen is how the first game approached it- pre-Hong Kong, you were forced to use a medpack system. Once you hit Versalife though, you've got access to a regenerating health system. If you choose regenerating health (and it's vastly more attractive than the alternative aug for that slot, so I don't know anybody who didn't choose it) then medpacks became a secondary, and no longer necessary element of resource management. The result was that halfway through the game, to match the increasing difficulty level of the enemies, the game effectively switched health mechanics- and the player stopped carrying medpacks and other food because they were no longer necessary. I'm just realizing this now, but in DX1, after Versalife (and the regen aug canister), you don't encounter anybody asking for food, like the kids in Battery Park, probably because the likelyhood of you already carrying a candybar at that point is drastically reduced. Huh. Now that I think about it, the regen aug didn't get rid of medpacks- it merely renamed them. Once you could convert BE into health, the BE Cell turned into the medpack. A regenerating health system, that's something close to Call of Duty 4 when you're in combat, and that still involves resource management. So it is possible to pull off in DX3- the first game proved as much.

The point was it wasn't similar to the Call of Duty model, for 3 key reasons:

1) It had to be activated. It was not passive.

2) It used biolelectric energy, meaning that a) it wasn't infinite, and b) using it meant you were taking resources away from other augs - you said it yourself, it's still resource management, just a different form of it.

3) It was optional. This is so important! You didn't have to use it. Yes, the alternative aug was crap (was it rebreather?) so most people probably did end up using regen, but the solution to that is to make the alternative aug better, not to remove the choice altogether. I really don't think anyone is arguing against the inclusion of regen as an optional aug, it just shouldn't be forced upon the player, and shouldn't be "free." The devs have said themselves that they are keen to focus on choice and consequence - by forcing regen health on the player, they're not giving us either.

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 15:20
The point was it wasn't similar to the Call of Duty model, for 3 key reasons:

1) It had to be activated. It was not passive.

2) It used biolelectric energy, meaning that a) it wasn't infinite, and b) using it meant you were taking resources away from other augs - you said it yourself, it's still resource management, just a different form of it.

3) It was optional. This is so important! You didn't have to use it. Yes, the alternative aug was crap (was it rebreather?) so most people probably did end up using regen, but the solution to that is to make the alternative aug better, not to remove the choice altogether. I really don't think anyone is arguing against the inclusion of regen as an optional aug, it just shouldn't be forced upon the player, and shouldn't be "free." The devs have said themselves that they are keen to focus on choice and consequence - by forcing regen health on the player, they're not giving us either.

I agree on all three points but you're incorrect (at least from where I'm standing) in saying that activated vs. passive makes it different from the CoD model- from a technical standpoint, it's different, sure, but the end result (and more or less, how quickly you return to full or fighting health) is essentially the same. As soon as you're out of the line of fire, whether automatic or pressing a key, the regeneration system is activated and you start regaining health. From a shooter player's perspective there's very little difference within that context. Now, having to choose to activate the system makes much more sense in terms of resource management, I agree with you there as well.

Ashpolt
24th Aug 2009, 15:34
I would disagree and say that active vs passive makes a lot of difference in terms of gameplay, especially when it comes to the dreaded issue of "dumbing down." Why should the game do something for me when it's something I can easily do for myself without interrupting the flow of the game? If I wanted a game that played itself, I'd watch a movie (or pick up the next Mario game....) It's something else to keep track of, and something else to be aware of. Plus, if you coupled it with a 2-3 second "activation" time and a suitably interesting animation, it'd add an extra element to it, rather than taking away. It's also crucial that it be active if it's going to drain BE (or equivalent) so that you can choose not to use it, in preference of using another aug instead. Choice and consequence.

Mezgrath
24th Aug 2009, 16:05
I will agree with Ashpolt.
There is a big difference between pressing a key and auto-regen.
Auto-regen will happen and will regen your health even if you want it or not, you don't have a choice.
But by pressing a key you choose the aug instead of a medkit, it is your choice if you want to enter the battle with half hp, or use a medkit/food/drink, or press the aug key.
Also the augmentation drains something, it is not free, and you have to upgrade it ( 3 whole canisters ) to work effectively.

gamer0004
24th Aug 2009, 17:46
I never stopped using medkits once I got the health regeneration aug. It's all about choice.

Also, active vs passive makes a huge difference: think about the use of passwords in IW.
And do you want this game to become like GTA? That you can't do (use/frob) anything that isn't strictly necessary to continue? Way to completely kill immersion.

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 17:49
I never stopped using medkits once I got the health regeneration aug. It's all about choice.

Really? I guess now I do know somebody who didn't use regen. :)


And do you want this game to become like GTA? That you can't do (use/frob) anything that isn't strictly necessary to continue? Way to completely kill immersion.

I never said I want the GTA system for DX 3 (aka "if it's not useful it's not useable").

gamer0004
24th Aug 2009, 17:54
Really? I guess now I do know somebody who didn't use regen. :)



I never said I want the GTA system for DX 3 (aka "if it's not useful it's not useable").

I did use health regen. I used both. So sue me.

Anyway:


I agree on all three points but you're incorrect (at least from where I'm standing) in saying that activated vs. passive makes it different from the CoD model- from a technical standpoint, it's different, sure, but the end result (and more or less, how quickly you return to full or fighting health) is essentially the same.


You essentially saying what I said about GTA. Because using items that are no use for progression means the end result is always the same: you still do the same things (destory X or talk to Y) with the same effect, because doing useless things like talking to random strangers doesn't change the outcome or progression of the game (although in DX it sometimes does, but let's just ignore that and look only at the really useless things).

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 17:58
I did use health regen. I used both. So sue me.

Anyway:


You essentially saying what I said about GTA. Because using items that are no use for progression means the end result is always the same: you still do the same things (destory X or talk to Y) with the same effect, because doing useless things like talking to random strangers doesn't change the outcome or progression of the game (although in DX it sometimes does, but let's just ignore that and look only at the really useless things).

You're taking it out of context. What I said was that within the short span right after the player ducks out of the line of fire, they are going to replenish health so they don't die when they re-engage the enemy. With a system that relies on health regeneration, be it automatic or user-activated, the player's health is going to start replenishing almost instantly. If it's automatic, then it starts replenishing after a set or variable duration, depending on how it's designed. With user-activation, the player just quickly hits a key. I'm not even touching medkits here.

gamer0004
24th Aug 2009, 18:02
You're taking it out of context. What I said was that within the short span right after the player ducks out of the line of fire, they are going to replenish health so they don't die when they re-engage the enemy. With a system that relies on health regeneration, be it automatic or user-activated, the player's health is going to start replenishing almost instantly. If it's automatic, then it starts replenishing after a set or variable duration, depending on how it's designed. With user-activation, the player just quickly hits a key. I'm not even touching medkits here.

I know, and that is enough. Did you like the system of IW where it automatically handled passwords and logins? I sure didn't, and I wouldn't like it if the game decided for me that I want to heal. Also, if the player has to press a button, it means BE is lost. This is not so with auto-regen (or if it is it's even worse).

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 18:06
I know, and that is enough. Did you like the system of IW where it automatically handled passwords and logins? I sure didn't, and I wouldn't like it if the game decided for me that I want to heal. Also, if the player has to press a button, it means BE is lost. This is not so with auto-regen (or if it is it's even worse).

So...are you assuming that based on that one little snippet I want that philosophy applied to every corner of the game? If you are, then let me correct you: I do not.

This is precisely why I agree that a user-controlled system makes more sense. What I was merely saying is that for a short span when health replenishment is the biggest priority, the two systems are not dissimilar.

gamer0004
24th Aug 2009, 18:26
So...are you assuming that based on that one little snippet I want that philosophy applied to every corner of the game? If you are, then let me correct you: I do not.

This is precisely why I agree that a user-controlled system makes more sense. What I was merely saying is that for a short span when health replenishment is the biggest priority, the two systems are not dissimilar.

Right, but then your ideas do not apply to games like DX(3).

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 19:08
Right, but then your ideas do not apply to games like DX(3).

Clarify? I'm not sure how to reply to that seeing as how I could interpret it any of 3 fairly different ways.

gamer0004
24th Aug 2009, 19:13
Clarify? I'm not sure how to reply to that seeing as how I could interpret it any of 3 fairly different ways.

"What I was merely saying is that for a short span when health replenishment is the biggest priority, the two systems are not dissimilar."
This was not (not should be) the case in Deus Ex (3).

Jerion
24th Aug 2009, 19:15
"What I was merely saying is that for a short span when health replenishment is the biggest priority, the two systems are not dissimilar."
This was not (not should be) the case in Deus Ex (3).

Ah yes, that doesn't apply to DX 3. :)

gamer0004
24th Aug 2009, 20:17
Ah yes, that doesn't apply to DX 3. :)

Let's call it a communication problem :)

Lady_Of_The_Vine
24th Aug 2009, 21:38
^
There's a lot of that going on in here. :whistle:

minus0ne
25th Aug 2009, 01:20
^^ but that still sounds like nanotech - small enough to float around in the blood stream, through all of those capillaries? This raises an interesting point - how can mechanical augmentation account for regenerating health? Oh, and food is a must. I always carried around a few forty's in my inventory to relax and wind down after an assassination or fire fight. Good fun.
Actually it doesn't even closely resemble nanotech, even if it sounds that way to you. They're just tiny capsules which can contain drugs and the like. A (separate) device has to direct ultrasound at the wounded tissue so the capsules burst and deliver their payload where it's needed.

Just to point out the difference with DX1 regeneration aug; that was "programmable polymerase" which interacted with protein production on a cellular level to 'intelligently' regenerate tissue. This "SonoDrugs" is actually so low-tech it's already actually being developed, right now :p (no disrespect to the fine work they're doing, but since DX3 will take place some two decades into the future it's not that much of a stretch to think it'll be thoroughly developed and perhaps widespread by then, at least in hospitals).

So let's say that not all is lost and that, for the sake of argument, DX3's health-regen will in fact be an (active) augmentation, much like DX1, which you gain at some point early/midway through the game. It would still need some kind of resource management, and therefore, resources. Nanotech is not an option, but a mechanical regeneration augmentation would still consume power, at the very least. Perhaps, on top of that, it could take in various chemicals and substances found in medkits and the like (medical glue, disinfectant, antibiotics, painkillers etc.), which is then distributed into these capsules. The capsules could be made of something like Aerogel, which would mean that the regeneration aug wouldn't need a regular refill of the basic substances from which the capsules are made (since Aerogel is something like 98,6% air).

Perhaps the regeneration aug could thereby plausibly make better use of a medkit, by more directly delivering the needed substances to the wounded tissue. So let's say a medkit, on its own, heals 30 points (or 30% of any limb). However, when you "feed" it into your regeneration aug, once you've gotten it, the same medkit could heal a greater amount of damage, let's say 40 points at baseline, and 60-80 or something at higher skill levels (assuming the health regeneration aug comes with its own skill-tree). You could have your regeneration augmentation "consume" and store the chemicals from, say, 4 or 5 medkits at a time. And after using all stored chemicals from medkits (ie depleting the aug), you'd need to feed it more medkits (and possibly energy), but it would still require a 'cooldown' period of, say, 4 minutes, in which the aug consumes the medkits and distribute the chemicals into capsules.

As long as they make it plausible enough to ease suspension of disbelief and don't turn it into some kind of super-healing fix-all solution without resource management, as most shooters do, I think something similar to this might work.

Daedalus.
25th Aug 2009, 01:57
Let's call it a communication problem :)


"...irreconcilable differences..."


Now, divorce and make-up.


.

Irate_Iguana
25th Aug 2009, 08:11
This "SonoDrugs" is actually so low-tech it's already actually being developed, right now :p (no disrespect to the fine work they're doing, but since DX3 will take place some two decades into the future it's not that much of a stretch to think it'll be thoroughly developed and perhaps widespread by then, at least in hospitals).

Actually stuff like this is already in your washing powder. They make capsules containing a fragrance. When your clothes move the capsules burst and release the fragrance. I've spent my last internship working on stuff like this.

TrickyVein
26th Aug 2009, 02:21
Actually it doesn't even closely resemble nanotech, even if it sounds that way to you.

???

are you one of those people who tells everyone else in the room how much you know, and then when everyone else leaves you end up wondering why no one likes you? where do you get off with a remark like that?

am I assuming too much to think that most everyone here is mature enough to hold intelligent debate without stooping to kindergarten level pop shots like that?

minus0ne
26th Aug 2009, 05:02
???

are you one of those people who tells everyone else in the room how much you know, and then when everyone else leaves you end up wondering why no one likes you? where do you get off with a remark like that?
What the hell? I have no idea what you're talking about. I don't know what got your panties in a bunch but it was in no way meant to be insulting, demeaning or condescending. I meant what I said, it doesn't resemble nanotechnology, even if it sounds that way (what with the small capsules), to you, or anyone else.

am I assuming too much to think that most everyone here is mature enough to hold intelligent debate without stooping to kindergarten level pop shots like that?
:p I don't know if English is your native language, but how is what I wrote a kindergarten level pop shot?

To quote gamer0004:

Let's call it a communication problem :)


Actually stuff like this is already in your washing powder. They make capsules containing a fragrance. When your clothes move the capsules burst and release the fragrance. I've spent my last internship working on stuff like this.
:nut: Wow, I didn't know that, that's crazy!

Daedalus.
12th May 2010, 18:02
.

we need pizza and ice cream

Scotch Whiskey on the rocks would be nice, and cigars with Brandy by the fire. :D

.

JCpies
12th May 2010, 18:37
Please let there be hotdogs and pies!

Also they need to let you carry out a heart bypass with a can of cola

KSingh77
12th May 2010, 18:38
Whoa

Didn't comment in a while,anyway looks like Adam didn't cough,gag and die from smoking that cigerette.

But gotts watch out for expired milk,gives you bad dirara.

Blade_hunter
12th May 2010, 20:31
If you can give that to your foes that could help you for stealth kills in bathrooms or simply make the guard unavailable for a while to guard a certain point of the map.

Daedalus CiarĂ¡n
13th May 2010, 08:40
The interesting thing about regen is how the first game approached it- pre-Hong Kong, you were forced to use a medpack system. Once you hit Versalife though, you've got access to a regenerating health system. If you choose regenerating health (and it's vastly more attractive than the alternative aug for that slot, so I don't know anybody who didn't choose it) then medpacks became a secondary, and no longer necessary element of resource management. The result was that halfway through the game, to match the increasing difficulty level of the enemies, the game effectively switched health mechanics- and the player stopped carrying medpacks and other food because they were no longer necessary. I'm just realizing this now, but in DX1, after Versalife (and the regen aug canister), you don't encounter anybody asking for food, like the kids in Battery Park, probably because the likelyhood of you already carrying a candybar at that point is drastically reduced. Huh. Now that I think about it, the regen aug didn't get rid of medpacks- it merely renamed them. Once you could convert BE into health, the BE Cell turned into the medpack. A regenerating health system, that's something close to Call of Duty 4 when you're in combat, and that still involves resource management. So it is possible to pull off in DX3- the first game proved as much.

I used medkits after getting the Regeneration Aug. Frankly there were too few upgrade canisters to max out the health aug and the other augmentations I used so RH cost too much to use on its own. At least on my first two play throughs. I used RH in battle and afterwards topped myself up using medkits. Thus I was able to save the BE to use on the other augs, rather than having RH drain my options.

Blade_hunter
13th May 2010, 10:53
You know this point have already been discussed and the final point is the regeneration biomod isn't equivalent to the regenerating health.
Sure it was better in therms of resource consumption than the health kits when it's fully upgraded with the power recirculator

But a point that ash made before is very interesting, it's the great fact that the alternate biomods is uninteresting in comparison to it; and that's the case, the biomod in question was an energy shield that filtered the damages from energy and flame weapons witch is much less useful than a biomod that can heal your wounds in exchange of some BE

That's one of the weak points of the game some biomods have practically no value, but I can even say that about some items, and even weapons.
Shifter corrected a lot of those mistakes.

Caradoc
13th May 2010, 13:19
we shouldn't really think food or drinks as a healing device/method. Besides its just silly that drinking a sip of water heals you. I see food, alchol, tobocco, soda automats, basketballs. telephones, computer, drugs, furniture, datacubes, newspapers, fliushable toilets and so forth as a way to interact with the gameworld... A source of immersion. I don't like static gameworld. :-)

MechBFP
13th May 2010, 15:39
Okay, I have one problem with what you said Mr.K when it came to the regen aug in DX being like the new system. The fact of the matter is, I could enable that aug DURING combat. The new system can NOT be enabled during combat.
That was one of the absolute best benefits of that aug and another reason why the new system takes away players options.

Blade_hunter
13th May 2010, 17:08
If you want to know how much silly things games have and feature; I can make a full list of them with the help of other people.

The realism isn't good at any stage in a game, realism tends sometimes to remove some amusement rather than adding some, even if sometimes it adds something fun, but it depends of what feature we are talking about.
Sometimes unrealism is better and even funnier than realism at some points

In games we can find a lot of silly things like using food as an health pack, but people just forget to make the reverse engineering theory to see why games features some things of that kind.

But personally I don't want to kill the "magic" that some great games provided to us, but I think some people wants somebody to do so.

RH takes away players options in some cases, but you can certainly regenerate you health in a middle of a fight, even if this one is made by the cost of just hide behind an obstacle.
And the new system doesn't need to be enabled or disabled, your health will recover automatically when it can do it ...
The benefits / inconvenients of RH are different than the ones of the Regeneration biomod.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
18th May 2010, 15:27
.... flushable toilets and so forth as a way to interact with the gameworld... A source of immersion. I don't like static gameworld. :-)

Would you use the basin to wash your hands after using the toilet?

rokstrombo
19th May 2010, 05:18
Why have flushable toilets become such a common feature in first person shooters? Who decided flushing toilets would be the funnest possible addition to a fantastical 3D virtual world anyway? Was it you Caradoc?

Dark Phoenix
19th May 2010, 21:41
I agree with food in games for health.. after all, that's how it works in real life. I want food to play as much a part in Deus Ex 3.

Here's an idea.. if your auto regenerating health.. make all the NPC's have auto regenerating health too. That way at least it will be more balanced.. But I know people will say it can't be done cus not everyone will have augs or a high tech suit.

Blade_hunter
20th May 2010, 01:16
Oh, that's not the problem, if you want to know my opinion, and it's fully possible to do this; but, you can't awaken your enemy at least for a long period of time.
Gameplay based on RH isn't very interesting, even if it will "balance" things I see your honorable point though.
It won't be great, some multiplayer games have some problems with RH

Flushing the toilets was always fun for me, since Duke Nukem 3D, it just allow you to be pleased that the world is interactive.
In all FPS when there is a bathroom I try to flush the toilets...
trigger a switch to put on or off lights; grabbing a random object to move it; open a door; use an oven; use a vending machine; use a vehicle; use a TV; use a radio; use water fountains; talk with an NPC; even if the interaction is pointless sometimes, but it's always fun.

In Duke Nukem I also loved the mirrors .

Interactive environments is much more a sign of richness than poverty in therms of game world.

JCpies
20th May 2010, 06:17
I used medkits after getting the Regeneration Aug. Frankly there were too few upgrade canisters to max out the health aug and the other augmentations I used so RH cost too much to use on its own. At least on my first two play throughs. I used RH in battle and afterwards topped myself up using medkits. Thus I was able to save the BE to use on the other augs, rather than having RH drain my options.

Wait, What!? There's a regeneration aug in versalife... O_o how have I not seen this after years of playing the game!!! :nut:

MechBFP
20th May 2010, 06:39
Wait, What!? There's a regeneration aug in versalife... O_o how have I not seen this after years of playing the game!!! :nut:

I just passed the game again and there isn't. You get one from the UNATCO HQ after you escape and another one in Area 51.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
20th May 2010, 17:34
Who decided flushing toilets would be the funnest possible addition to a fantastical 3D virtual world anyway? Was it you Caradoc?

He should have suggested moving/useable toilet paper on a roll...









PS. I am not serious, by the way.

Blade_hunter
20th May 2010, 18:37
You can use it to fear your opponents :P
Ok I'm just joking.

Jerion
20th May 2010, 18:45
I just passed the game again and there isn't. You get one from the UNATCO HQ after you escape and another one in Area 51.

There's a regen aug in the NSF Warehouse or HQ, There's one at UNATCO, and there's one at Versalife (Level 2 labs, IIRC). You can get it very early on in the game.

MechBFP
20th May 2010, 22:19
There's a regen aug in the NSF Warehouse or HQ, There's one at UNATCO, and there's one at Versalife (Level 2 labs, IIRC). You can get it very early on in the game.

I would love proof of the ones in the NSF Warehouse and Versalife. I am 99.99% sure there isn't.

Blade_hunter
20th May 2010, 22:53
Hums this sounds strange I never found the regen aug until the moment I see Jaime in the unatco escape.

Jerion
20th May 2010, 23:40
I would love proof of the ones in the NSF Warehouse and Versalife. I am 99.99% sure there isn't.

Ok. I'll go boot up the old G3 and play those areas. I'll post up pictures.


Edit: It's the darndest thing. I coulda sworn there was a regen aug at versalife or at least in Hong Kong but I can't find it. I was wrong about Hells Kitchen too.

There only places with regen augs, it seems are UNATCO HQ (post-breakout) and Area 51. :hmm:

Daedalus.
21st May 2010, 17:23
Why have flushable toilets become such a common feature in first person shooters? Who decided flushing toilets would be the funnest possible addition to a fantastical 3D virtual world anyway? Was it you Caradoc?


Flushable toilets in the restrooms / bathrooms makes the world more realistic. Have you ever been in a real world restroom / bathroom with non-flushable toilets? I have not.


.

Daedalus.
21st May 2010, 18:22
Wait, What!? There's a regeneration aug in versalife... O_o how have I not seen this after years of playing the game!!! :nut:

.




I just passed the game again and there isn't. You get one from the UNATCO HQ after you escape and another one in Area 51.

.




There's a regen aug in the NSF Warehouse or HQ, There's one at UNATCO, and there's one at Versalife (Level 2 labs, IIRC). You can get it very early on in the game.

.




I would love proof of the ones in the NSF Warehouse and Versalife. I am 99.99% sure there isn't.

.


The Augmentation Canister in map 02_NYC_Warehouse / NSF Warehouse has AddAugs = AugSpeed and AugStealth. Map 04_NYC_NSFHQ (NSF HQ) does not have an Augmentation Canister in it. Versalife Lab / 06_HongKong_MJ12lab has three Augmentation Canisters: AugmentationCannister0 has AddAugs = AugTarget and AugVision, AugmentationCannister1 has AddAugs = AugRadarTrans and AugCloak, and AugmentationCannister3 has AddAugs = AugDrone and AugDefense.

The first place that you can get the Regeneration Aug is in 05_NYC_UNATCOHQ, after you escape from MJ12 Jail / 05_NYC_UNATCOMJ12lab. The Canister contains AddAugs = AugHealing (Regeneration) and AugShield. There is another one in 15_Area51_Entrance / AREA 51 with AddAugs = AugHealing (Regeneration) and AugShield.

The only person who was correct, was MechBFP. Nice work, m8. :worship: :gamer:


:zzZ:
.

Irate_Iguana
21st May 2010, 18:43
Flushable toilets in the restrooms / bathrooms makes the world more realistic. Have you ever been in a real world restroom / bathroom with non-flushable toilets? I have not.

There is a lot of stuff that is not realistic in gameworlds.

Daedalus.
21st May 2010, 18:54
There is a lot of stuff that is not realistic in gameworlds.

.


Well, then, Professional Video Game Developers need to work better to make their games fully realistic.


.

Irate_Iguana
21st May 2010, 19:01
Well, then, Professional Video Game Developers need to work better to make their games fully realistic.

The last thing I want is a realistic game. It sucks ass having to fly for 12 hours in real time in order to get to your next mission. Or having to spend months in a hospital doing physical therapy in order to regain functionality and strength in your limbs after being shot. There are a lot of acceptable breaks from reality.

LyreOfNero
21st May 2010, 19:02
Not necessarily. If what we wanted was full on realism we could go outside and experience that as there would be no point to simulate it. A video game is a fantasy when it boils down to it. That includes some things that are in the realm of "unlikely to happen" along with things that are outright impossible. The fantasy is part of what makes it fun. If Morrowind had been realistic, there would be no magic or monsters. A step further, if Deus Ex had been realistic, there would be no instant heal health packs or being able to run away while being shot. What I think you mean is that it should fool us into thinking its real. The whole suspension of disbelief that gets used when talking about film and theatre.

Vasarto
21st May 2010, 20:38
I think there should be food in DX3. Just a MUCH more Varied amount of it. Like in Bars you can order hotwings,Chessy Chili Fries and more then one Brand of Soda. Like Coca Cola or pepsi products like Dew and all its flavors. Or being able to run by a restaurant and order spaghetti, Omelets and Orange Juice etc. Each Item restores fatigue or better yet.
Make it something you HAVE to do once in a while in the game.

If your Hero goes a certain time without eating. Lets say start from the beginning of the game. After each mission or at LEAST each time your back in base or on the streets. If you don't eat, Sooner or later down in the game you find out its been five days since you eaten last and you die or something like that.

Blade_hunter
21st May 2010, 21:12
Oh they can make for the food a fun gimmick like if you eat some food you can hear Adam saying
*This tastes really good* or even use the food to unlock some conversation lines in the case if you can offer it to the NPC ...
Personally there is some possibilities even if they have no use for our character it can be used to interact with the world ...

Lady_Of_The_Vine
23rd May 2010, 00:40
Oh they can make for the food a fun gimmick like if you eat some food you can hear Adam saying
*This tastes really good... even though it's meat-free!*


Oh, I like that idea! Good one. :thumb:





















:naughty:

KSingh77
23rd May 2010, 01:39
This really tastes good and it regenerates my health!

Lady_Of_The_Vine
23rd May 2010, 20:27
^
Yeah, guess you already know that it takes less energy to digest non-meat foods. :thumb:

Lady_Of_The_Vine
23rd May 2010, 21:40
^
You okay?
I'm only teasing... nothing to be scared of.